Rethinking the appropriate size of pots

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Bok
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Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:15 pm

One benefit from using a large pot could also be the increased interaction of the brew with oxygen.

For normal gongfu-size, some (me included) account for this by slightly lifting the lid when pouring, allowing for that extra O2 to improve the result. As a side effect it also increases pour speed.
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Shine Magical
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Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:24 pm

Bok wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:15 pm
For normal gongfu-size, some (me included) account for this by slightly lifting the lid when pouring, allowing for that extra O2 to improve the result. As a side effect it also increases pour speed.
I need to try this out! By what amount do you lift the lid?
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Bok
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Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:43 pm

Shine Magical wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:24 pm
Bok wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:15 pm
For normal gongfu-size, some (me included) account for this by slightly lifting the lid when pouring, allowing for that extra O2 to improve the result. As a side effect it also increases pour speed.
I need to try this out! By what amount do you lift the lid?
As much as I feel safe with the same hand I am pouring, basically tilting the lid with one finger.
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Tillerman
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 1:12 am

Bok wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:43 pm
Shine Magical wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:24 pm
Bok wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:15 pm
For normal gongfu-size, some (me included) account for this by slightly lifting the lid when pouring, allowing for that extra O2 to improve the result. As a side effect it also increases pour speed.
I need to try this out! By what amount do you lift the lid?
As much as I feel safe with the same hand I am pouring, basically tilting the lid with one finger.
Odd, I just realized that unconsciously I have been lightly lifting the lid when pouring. Then again, I use larger pots (150 - 220ml) when I brew. I'm a tea hog.
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Bok
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 1:54 am

@Tillerman I think it is a natural thing to do when brewing for a long time. Or maybe I subconsciously picked it up while watching others?

Especially useful with some of the F1 pots where the workmanship is often not the best.
Ethan Kurland
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 4:27 am

Bok wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:15 pm
One benefit from using a large pot could also be the increased interaction of the brew with oxygen.

For normal gongfu-size, some (me included) account for this by slightly lifting the lid when pouring, allowing for that extra O2 to improve the result. As a side effect it also increases pour speed.
One might make comparisons trying to notice a difference; however, I must ask, "Does air on the surface of hot water get into the water?"

It reminds me when I criticized people saying boiling water takes oxygen out of the water. I argued then water boiling too long could become hydrogen. I don't think this happens, and I don't think water can become more than one part oxygen to two parts hydrogen. If lifting lids while pouring adds flavor, perhaps another explanation.....

Cheers
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Shine Magical
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 8:58 am

Bok wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:43 pm
Shine Magical wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:24 pm
Bok wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:15 pm
For normal gongfu-size, some (me included) account for this by slightly lifting the lid when pouring, allowing for that extra O2 to improve the result. As a side effect it also increases pour speed.
I need to try this out! By what amount do you lift the lid?
As much as I feel safe with the same hand I am pouring, basically tilting the lid with one finger.
Why not just take the lid off when possible while pouring?
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Bok
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 10:06 am

Easier to just lift it while pouring and no need to worry that it will overflow
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Shine Magical
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 10:16 am

I tested this on a fairly delicate modern style puer and the brew does seem more flavorful, I'm able to tell more of the nuances.
Nice. Such a small but apparently important tip I didn't know about. :D So blown away

Thank you
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Bok
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 6:53 pm

Shine Magical wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 10:16 am
I tested this on a fairly delicate modern style puer and the brew does seem more flavorful, I'm able to tell more of the nuances.
Nice. Such a small but apparently important tip I didn't know about. :D So blown away

Thank you
You are welcome :)
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Bok
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 6:57 pm

Ethan Kurland wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 4:27 am
One might make comparisons trying to notice a difference; however, I must ask, "Does air on the surface of hot water get into the water?"
I think it is more of an interaction/reaction kind of thing. For example, leave brewed tea in an open vessel and it will quite obviously change colour due to oxidation. In a close pot which is filled to the top, little oxygen can interact with the brew. With the lid lifted some kind of subtle interaction seems to happen.
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 10:37 pm

Bok wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 6:57 pm
I think it is more of an interaction/reaction kind of thing. For example, leave brewed tea in an open vessel and it will quite obviously change colour due to oxidation. In a close pot which is filled to the top, little oxygen can interact with the brew. With the lid lifted some kind of subtle interaction seems to happen.
[/quote]
"interaction/reaction kind of thing" is the kind of language that I can understand. For a bit of truth and humor, I admit that I also understand breaking lids more than the subtle difference of a bit more air into a pot; so, I will put a finger on the lid sometimes when I think it may go flying but never think to use a finger to lift a lid for aeration. Cheers
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Bok
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 10:54 pm

@Ethan Kurland be careful, the lid lifting can be tricky with some pots!

I know others who will never, ever do that, too worried about their pots :)
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Baisao
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 11:14 pm

Bok wrote:
Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:15 pm
One benefit from using a large pot could also be the increased interaction of the brew with oxygen.

For normal gongfu-size, some (me included) account for this by slightly lifting the lid when pouring, allowing for that extra O2 to improve the result. As a side effect it also increases pour speed.
I think you and I first spoke of this some months back when discussing how to increase pour speed without mechanically altering teapots. I’ve done it regularly, even with antique teapots, if I think the flow is obstructed and needs a little more throughput. It’s seldom a matter of the knob hole being too small except on some F1s.

I have my doubts about extra oxygen helping the flavor as air is flowing into the teapot so that the tea can exit. It’s not even “extra” air as it will be the same volume of air as the volume of tea that exits the teapot.

To touch on the spirit of this thread: I’ve been saying for some time now that you can make great tea in coffee cup if you have enough talent with GFC. Of course this could apply to a bowl or any heat resistant, non-reactive vessel. My point has been that fancy pots and rare clays are not needed to make great tea, so focus on skills rather than expensive equipment. This is usually something I say to people at that point where they lack mastery but are overly enthused by rare clays with magical reputations.
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Bok
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Thu Nov 29, 2018 11:26 pm

Of course that is true. If it were only for that I’d stick to a gaiwan. But having tea is a wholesome experience and beautiful teaware, maybe even paired with historical relevance, adds a lot to the pleasure, for me at least.

I was more sceptical in the past of certain attributes of supposedly famous clays, but recently came across quite a few examples of why - if you find the right pot - clay can change everything!

Mostly, the nuances are too small though to justify the investment.
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