lemme have my confirmation bias and fun lolYou want someone to tell you it's ok to drink your CLT samples today, huh?
Science behind letting puerh "rest" after shipment?
Welp, I pulled my tea out of the fridge last night, and just drank it now.
The 2005/2001 Awazon shu tasted much the same as it does every other time I drink it when steeped normally. I let the fourth steep run on until the tea was basically black, and it tasted heavily of prunes, which is not something I've tasted in this tea before. It was also very-slightly sour in a way that I haven't detected in this tea before when overbrewed.
The 8582-806 tasted much the same, but there was a mild wet-sourness that is atypical, and I recognised it immediately.
I little while ago I stored some of the 8582 and some 2015 Sen Zhi Kui Cake of Jingmai in small plastic bags at 71%, 75% and 100% humidity for about a month to see how long it might take for them to develop mould at my usual temperatures.
The 100% quickly developed a mild unpleasant cold/wet kind of smell (and the leaves became very malleable), and the 75% had a little of that toward the end as well. When the 100% developed mould, I drank the 75/71% and detected the same mild wet-sourness in each of those to what I'm getting today.
I wonder if sealed tea experiencing a period of very low temperature can cause humidity to spike and support some sort of microbial action that isn't typically seen at sane temps/humidity. I have another pot's worth of the 8582 that I'll be tasting in another two weeks, leaving the mylar foil bag sealed to see if anything changes.
The 8582 did not regain any of the elements that made it undrinkable when it arrived from the vendor, so I'm still inclined to think that there is an element of needing to air out after removal from tong/warehouse that exists separate to what's going on here.
Mopar, interested to hear your thoughts when you try your samples.
I am still stuck in transit for what I wanted to experiment with. It has reached Los Angeles so hopefully soon. I may seal some as well and see how it performs. I see you saw some differences in yours.Atlas wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2018 2:32 pmWelp, I pulled my tea out of the fridge last night, and just drank it now.
The 2005/2001 Awazon shu tasted much the same as it does every other time I drink it when steeped normally. I let the fourth steep run on until the tea was basically black, and it tasted heavily of prunes, which is not something I've tasted in this tea before. It was also very-slightly sour in a way that I haven't detected in this tea before when overbrewed.
The 8582-806 tasted much the same, but there was a mild wet-sourness that is atypical, and I recognised it immediately.
I little while ago I stored some of the 8582 and some 2015 Sen Zhi Kui Cake of Jingmai in small plastic bags at 71%, 75% and 100% humidity for about a month to see how long it might take for them to develop mould at my usual temperatures.
The 100% quickly developed a mild unpleasant cold/wet kind of smell (and the leaves became very malleable), and the 75% had a little of that toward the end as well. When the 100% developed mould, I drank the 75/71% and detected the same mild wet-sourness in each of those to what I'm getting today.
I wonder if sealed tea experiencing a period of very low temperature can cause humidity to spike and support some sort of microbial action that isn't typically seen at sane temps/humidity. I have another pot's worth of the 8582 that I'll be tasting in another two weeks, leaving the mylar foil bag sealed to see if anything changes.
The 8582 did not regain any of the elements that made it undrinkable when it arrived from the vendor, so I'm still inclined to think that there is an element of needing to air out after removal from tong/warehouse that exists separate to what's going on here.
Mopar, interested to hear your thoughts when you try your samples.
I see this is an old topic, but I have been searching and have not found any answers to this question. So I have some speculation I would like to share...
A first thought is that shipping materials are affecting the tea, especially plastics which become more volatile in higher temperatures. Could flavors and smells from plastic bags, mylar envelopes, or shipping materials be leaching into the tea? It seems probable.
Also, we know that puer changes over time. Unless I am mistaken, the agents of this change are enzymes and microorganisms (fungi and bacteria). High humidity and temperatures accelerate microbial activity. Enzyme activity is also influenced by temperature and humidity, and different enzymes are active at different temperatures. Tea that is shipped can experience a range of temperatures, air pressure, and humidity levels. Yes, many vendors seal the tea in plastic or mylar envelopes, but that does not mean the tea will be completely protected from environmental changes, especially if pressure changes overcome the protective properties of packaging. And certainly different vendors use different packaging; some better than others. I see 3 potential implications of all this.
1. The shipping process is going to expose the tea to temperatures and humidity levels outside of what we consider to be ideal. And so enzymes that might be inactive during normal storage conditions might become active during the shipping process, which could have the potential to alter the tea in potentially undesirable ways. I know nothing about the enzymes in tea, and so this is complete speculation.
2. Microorganisms are affecting the quality of shipped teas. Microorganisms react when stressed. They release different compounds when they are stressed than when they are in a healthy environment. Also, unfavorable conditions can trigger a reproductive survival response that results in the release of spores or an alteration in the living cells, transforming them into a dormancy state. This last I find most probable. What if we are tasting spores in recently shipped teas? And when we restore the tea to favorable (for the microorganisms) conditions, the spores or dormant cells reanimate and begin healthy microbial activity.
3. There could be chemical changes in the molecules in the tea from all of these environmental changes.
As I said at the start, these are some guesses on my part based on my very limited knowledge. But I wanted to put this out there since I have not seen any scientific explanations or data. My hope is that someone with the skills ( anyone know a biochemist?) will put these ideas to the test (assuming this hasn't happened already).
I'd love to hear any additional thoughts or constructive criticisms that you may have, especially if someone can provide data to either support or disprove these ideas.
Thanks for reading!
Dan
A first thought is that shipping materials are affecting the tea, especially plastics which become more volatile in higher temperatures. Could flavors and smells from plastic bags, mylar envelopes, or shipping materials be leaching into the tea? It seems probable.
Also, we know that puer changes over time. Unless I am mistaken, the agents of this change are enzymes and microorganisms (fungi and bacteria). High humidity and temperatures accelerate microbial activity. Enzyme activity is also influenced by temperature and humidity, and different enzymes are active at different temperatures. Tea that is shipped can experience a range of temperatures, air pressure, and humidity levels. Yes, many vendors seal the tea in plastic or mylar envelopes, but that does not mean the tea will be completely protected from environmental changes, especially if pressure changes overcome the protective properties of packaging. And certainly different vendors use different packaging; some better than others. I see 3 potential implications of all this.
1. The shipping process is going to expose the tea to temperatures and humidity levels outside of what we consider to be ideal. And so enzymes that might be inactive during normal storage conditions might become active during the shipping process, which could have the potential to alter the tea in potentially undesirable ways. I know nothing about the enzymes in tea, and so this is complete speculation.
2. Microorganisms are affecting the quality of shipped teas. Microorganisms react when stressed. They release different compounds when they are stressed than when they are in a healthy environment. Also, unfavorable conditions can trigger a reproductive survival response that results in the release of spores or an alteration in the living cells, transforming them into a dormancy state. This last I find most probable. What if we are tasting spores in recently shipped teas? And when we restore the tea to favorable (for the microorganisms) conditions, the spores or dormant cells reanimate and begin healthy microbial activity.
3. There could be chemical changes in the molecules in the tea from all of these environmental changes.
As I said at the start, these are some guesses on my part based on my very limited knowledge. But I wanted to put this out there since I have not seen any scientific explanations or data. My hope is that someone with the skills ( anyone know a biochemist?) will put these ideas to the test (assuming this hasn't happened already).
I'd love to hear any additional thoughts or constructive criticisms that you may have, especially if someone can provide data to either support or disprove these ideas.
Thanks for reading!
Dan