2019 from Wuyi Origin?

Chadrinkincat
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Thu Sep 19, 2019 10:03 pm

Has anyone tried the 2019 selection of yancha from wuyiorigin yet?

I’ve been craving yancha but somehow I’ve avoided buying any for awhile. It’s probably a good time to stock up now that the cold weather is creeping in.
carogust
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Fri Sep 20, 2019 4:27 am

I've not tried their 2019 selection but I've been drinking now and then their 2018 shuixian. It is very good. Not as flavorful as I'd like but it has elements and character of other more high-end yancha.
The 2018 was 4 times roasted and the 2019 is 2 times so it is probably a little different and maybe better.
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Fri Sep 20, 2019 9:32 am

Chadrinkincat wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 10:03 pm
Has anyone tried the 2019 selection of yancha from wuyiorigin yet?

I’ve been craving yancha but somehow I’ve avoided buying any for awhile. It’s probably a good time to stock up now that the cold weather is creeping in.
I have tried 2 versions of the rou gui (both good - one roasted twice, the other 3 times), and the qi dan - which is excellent. Just received a sample of shui jin gui which I am looking forward to trying later today.
Chadrinkincat
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Fri Sep 20, 2019 10:06 pm

I’ve filled up the cart a bunch of times but this is first time I’ve actually followed through with purchase. 175g isn’t much but should last me till January. It would be nice if one of these turned into a larger purchase seeing as I prefer yancha w/ a few years age.
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tjkdubya
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Sun Sep 22, 2019 1:12 am

Hello. First post here.

Of the 2019 I've sampled a few so far: Wuyuanjian boutique RG, fruity RG, Mituoyan TLH, Huiyuankeng LCSX, qilan maocha after just one roast, and a Tianxinyan GCSX (not on website). Most of these are getting an additional roast in October so that's something to keep in mind if you're buying now.

-

The boutique RG is quite good but not mind-blowing good. The LCSX looks solid, maybe will turn out even a bit better than last year.

The Tianxinyan GCSX is at 3x roast now just as the LCSX, but the big difference is higher roast temperature in the 3rd roast for the former. This is the style they prefer in-house, even though market demand is a gentler 3rd roast which is what they're doing for most of the teas. I prefer the lower temp roast you can see on the LCSX now personally, but this is a good thing to pick up if you're curious to see a different style.

The jinmaohou, I will be stocking up on, if last year's is any guide.

The other high priced stuff on the website... I just didn't think they were really great last year and I'm not expecting them to be this year. Maybe the qidan, which took a lot longer than other 2018s to start showing up settled. YMMV :D

The mid-priced stuff... Eh.

The value stuff... Qilan is quite good material, gaocong. As far as congwei-per-dollar metric goes, it's the best bet.
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Sun Sep 22, 2019 2:25 am

@tjkdubya Welcome to TeaForum. Glad to have this information, as I also have been thinking of placing an order this fall.
Chadrinkincat
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Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:48 pm

Thanks for replies.

@tjkdubya
Very useful information. Thanks!
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tjkdubya
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Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:37 pm

I don't mean to say their other teas aren't worthwhile to try. I'm also interested to hear what others have thought about the 2018 lineup as well as the 2019.

It's just that, several of their yancha in the $20-22 per 25g bracket, imo there's a pretty big difference in quality from the best to the worst. The 2018 laojunmei for instance, was bitterly disappointing (excuse the quip) compared to how good that cultivar can be... Obv, all these things are subjective in the end. Maybe some people loved that one, and I cannot argue.
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Bok
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Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:47 pm

tjkdubya wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:37 pm
I don't mean to say their other teas aren't worthwhile to try. I'm also interested to hear what others have thought about the 2018 lineup as well as the 2019.

It's just that, several of their yancha in the $20-22 per 25g bracket, imo there's a pretty big difference in quality from the best to the worst. The 2018 laojunmei for instance, was bitterly disappointing (excuse the quip) compared to how good that cultivar can be... Obv, all these things are subjective in the end. Maybe some people loved that one, and I cannot argue.
Firstly welcome to the forum! I think we follow each others IG already :mrgreen:

Maybe a silly question – why order from Western facing vendors, wouldn't you be able to get Yancha more economically and potentially better in China? Of course I know that the sourcing is hard even in China itself and prices are astronomical for the good stuff, but still?
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Brent D
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Mon Sep 23, 2019 6:21 pm

Always had great luck with their yanchas. Its my go to place for quality for the buck.
Anyone ever try their dancong?
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Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:01 pm

Brent D wrote:
Mon Sep 23, 2019 6:21 pm
Always had great luck with their yanchas. Its my go to place for quality for the buck.
Anyone ever try their dancong?
The dancong are very good - perhaps not the very, very best - but very good. I have always avoided ya shi xiang until i tasted their single tree version - I was impressed.
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tjkdubya
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Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:50 am

Bok wrote:
Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:47 pm
Firstly welcome to the forum! I think we follow each others IG already :mrgreen:

Maybe a silly question – why order from Western facing vendors, wouldn't you be able to get Yancha more economically and potentially better in China? Of course I know that the sourcing is hard even in China itself and prices are astronomical for the good stuff, but still?
Hi there. Thanks for all the teaware fomo on IG :D

It's a good question, and one that probably begets a dozen more questions. Regarding Wuyi Origin, their main business is mainland isn't it? I believe Cindy moves about 2,500 kg of yancha a year, with wholesale buyers (teahouses, etc) buying tens of kg lots and private tea circle group buys doing few kg level buys. She's a producer-vendor doing a mix of wholesale and direct-to-consumer, with probably a regular customer base numbering in the hundreds, and she's opened a side window facing West, probably to diversify her customer base. It's not exactly Western-facing in the sense that, say, LazyCat is.

I don't know of another mainland-focused yancha producer (not curator-vendors) doing direct sales to the West on a full lineup of teas on a click-n-buy webstore... If anyone knows of other examples I'd love to know.

I'm majority US-based and do buy a lot through Western-facing or Western-catering vendors. I've been curious where a vendor like Wuyi Origin stands among mainland drinkers, so for the past year I've been bringing back samples of most of her teas to Beijing, as well as having friends order samples directly from her as any other mainland customers would do, and tasting through and assessing compared to other yancha sources (there are so many, and it's hard to make sense of, but more on that later...). Some things I learned:
  • Western webstore customers aren't paying more as far as I know, jin for jin, but at the end of the day paying a hefty premium simply because they're buying 25/75g packs.
  • On the whole, the feeling is that these teas are skillfully made, even as they might not be the best materials, and they know how to make something tasty to fit with the prevailing market demand.
  • Quality-wise, this is about what they would expect at these prices. One or two teas have stood out as quite good for the price, but the rest are in the "fair deal" category.
  • Some doubts expressed about the source of these leaves. "How can fully hand-processed Wuyuanjian be this cheap?" And also, "Going by what's in the cup, wouldn't be surprise if not pure Zhengyan..." But again, prices seem to match expectations.
  • Upon tasting through a lot of Western-purchased teas, they've expressed that it seems there's a minimum standard being met for Western-facing sales, whereas for mainland buyers trying a new vendor it's quite easy to just get crap tea.
So all this has been pretty interesting to assess so far, and I plan on continuing, more or less using Wuyi Origin as a case study for trying to understand where people are on both sides of the Pacific on yancha price/quality expectations. Would I buy from her otherwise? Yes, but being more picky about what looks promising, not so widely sampling more than half the yancha she sells.

Regarding LazyCat, a Western-facing vendor in the sense that I think you intend: Would I be able to buy the same teas cheaper in China if I knew the sources? Yes. Would it be cheaper if I had to do the digging and sourcing and traveling and such? Definitely not. I buy from LazyCat because I think they have good taste and some quite good teas, and I appreciate that the time and the effort to curate don't come for free. Mainland drinkers who buy through retail vendors are also paying a premium. The challenge there is finding the needles in haystacks upon haystacks; you can put in the effort, or just pay someone to do it.

Long story short, it seems you can get yancha more economically in China, and it can be potentially better but also potentially a lot worse. I remember one time, someone excited brought back a special yancha series sample pack that was quite pricey, produced by some famous tea professor in Xiamen, and we arranged a group tasting, and went through each sample one by one. Each one was just as disappointing as the one before. I said something like, "Well if we have to pick one, that TLH had the least amount of flaws, and ignoring cultivar expectations, it's pleasant." "But that's not what TLH is supposed to taste like!!" Queue lots of fuming. :lol:

The tendency I think is, if someone stumbles onto a source of good RG or whatever, they stick with it as long as they can. No one I know is assessing the hundreds of producers and the tens of thousands of vendors, and have a global sense of who's got which good yancha, harvest after harvest.

Excuse the long ramble, but I've been really curious to hear about other people's experiences along these lines.
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Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:19 am

@tjkdubya Thanks a lot for this very interesting reply, please feel free to ramble on!

Also very intriguing study you are taking on there, keep us posted. Also a lot of good points you make there. Probably worth starting a topic on its own, based on your investigations?

I am based in Asia, so I rarely, if ever buy from Western facing vendors, yet for Yancha I have made the exception, simply due to the difficulty to get it in Taiwan. I met the Lazy Cat in Shanghai and had a first-hand tasting of his teas and I do agree, I like his selection. My point of reference for Yancha are teas given to me by generous friends with better access to those teas. I do not think I could even afford to buy them… and they have never met their match so far in terms of quality and taste. So I enjoy the little stash slowly and with focus.

I never tried Wuyiorigin, but as your experience seems to confirm, the price seems unlikely to nmatch the tea in some cases, but it is all good as long as the price is fair for what the tea is. After all I am regularly drinking “Dayuling” when I know fully well, that it can not be at the price I bought it for…

I also tried Essence of Tea’s Yancha a long time ago, but I prefer to forget about that experience…
carogust
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Thu Sep 26, 2019 5:03 am

Bok wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:19 am
I am based in Asia, so I rarely, if ever buy from Western facing vendors, yet for Yancha I have made the exception, simply due to the difficulty to get it in Taiwan. I met the Lazy Cat in Shanghai and had a first-hand tasting of his teas and I do agree, I like his selection. My point of reference for Yancha are teas given to me by generous friends with better access to those teas. I do not think I could even afford to buy them… and they have never met their match so far in terms of quality and taste. So I enjoy the little stash slowly and with focus.
I'm kind of curious if you could give a more "grounded" comparison of more available yancha and the high-end you've been exposed to. Like I'm curious to know what is "missing" from the more run of the mill stuff.
Most of the time the description of high-end whatever, especially tea, is kind of flowery and unbelievable. Sure it might be quite overwhelming/startling/exciting the first few times when you try stuff outside of your normal quality range, but as a result the memory is quite influenced by emotions. Usually the first session that goes right with a high end tea is the most memorable and "intense" but after you a few times you start to get used to it and it is not as exciting anymore.
Of course if you're not into making tasting notes and whatever you don't have to. And it is kind of impossible to describe these things anyways. (also yes, this is kinda offtopic)
Bok wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:19 am
I also tried Essence of Tea’s Yancha a long time ago, but I prefer to forget about that experience…
I've heard that EoT yancha is very good. Kind of surprised to hear this?
Kind of planning to sample some in the neat future.
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Thu Sep 26, 2019 6:28 am

@carogust well I think people might think their Yancha is very good due to lack of comparison. Also their main specialty is Puerh, which I haven’t tried. Seems to me their Yancha sources have dried up, they used to have a much larger selection... I, like you had high expectations, but for my part was quite disappointed. Not bad tea, just too pricey for what it was.

In regards to what is missing on mediocre Yancha compared to a good one, that is tricky as you mentioned. Everyone’s point of reference is different, my memory of how a grape tasted might be different than yours and so on - But

Some things like Yanyun, the famous rock flavour of Zhengyan Yancha, or Congwei(old growth tree flavour) of a Laocong, are things that should be there in a premium tea. The only way to know what that tastes like is really only to taste it, best side by side with a that doesn’t have it. These things are so unique, that you can’t really know unless you experienced it.

Average Yancha is just flat. Maybe one or two good cups but that is it. So. It bad tea, just usually too expensive for how little it delivers. A good Yancha will taste clean, and have little faults, like roastiness, too much fire, bitterness, often something I like to call dustiness, etc. It lacks depth. Premium Yancha is also a subtle tea, it doesn’t hit you in the face from the first cup like a Dancong, it creeps up on you slowly.

A good way to taste and test the essence of any Yancha, is to keep the first rinse aside and drink it in the end. Like cupping a tea, this will show all the shortcomings of the tea. If it is a good tea it will be the best cup of the session! Good thing it comes last ;)
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