Is Refrigeration for Japanese Green Tea Necessary?

User avatar
debunix
Posts: 1812
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:27 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Sat Apr 11, 2020 8:06 pm

faj wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 6:06 pm
A while ago, I kept a few empty bags and tested them on a vacuum sealer, without any content, just to see if they would seal. They are thicker than the bags typically used for vacuum sealing, and it took longer for a good seal to be achieved, but it was otherwise successful.

I wonder how vacuum sealing would compare to nitro flushing for refrigerated storage.

Has anyone tried this before?
The vacuum sealer crushes delicate senchas and twisty oolongs and white teas if sealed directly in vacuum seal-a-meal bags, but putting leaves or pouches in a canning jar and using a sealing attachmen for that works fine.
Slurp
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:20 pm

Sun Apr 12, 2020 12:22 pm

I guess my experience has been different from everyone else's. I've never refrigerated teas and haven't noticed any loss of flavor in unopened vacuum or nitrogen filled packets even for many months after purchase.
twta500
Posts: 19
Joined: Mon Jan 27, 2020 4:34 am
Location: California

Sun Apr 12, 2020 12:25 pm

Victoria wrote:
Sat Apr 11, 2020 6:45 pm
twta500 wrote:
Sat Apr 11, 2020 3:14 pm
Victoria wrote:
Sat Apr 11, 2020 12:49 pm
I think overall three years or less is probably generally the best time frame for optimal refrigeration, although with a few six years has been just fine. I just over-bought, then switched to oolong, and found myself with this long term storage situation. Has led to interesting revelations and results.
Do you think "investing" in a separate minifridge solely for tea would be worth it if I'm able to finish it all within a year?
Many people do this. If you have the room, I’d recommend doing that, even if you probably won’t use it all for tea. Those 100gram packs don’t take up much room. Less likelihood of garlic and fish aromas mingling with your teas. I like cooking and so there are interesting scents milling around in there. That’s why I use those odor moisture proof hunting bags, just in case there would be any transference. Currently, I use a lower fruit bin for teas, more than enough room.
Do you think a ziplock freezer bag will be good enough for unopened tea packages if I have a minifridge solely for storing tea?
If yes, basically:
Unopened: Put unopened tea package into ziplock, push out air + throw in an oxygen absorber, and put into fridge.
Opened: Put opened tea package into canning jar, remove air, put into frige

Will I run into any condensation issues for constantly taking out and re-refrigerating the opened tea inside a canning jar?
Slurp wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 12:22 pm
I guess my experience has been different from everyone else's. I've never refrigerated teas and haven't noticed any loss of flavor in unopened vacuum or nitrogen filled packets even for many months after purchase.
How do you store your opened tea packages?
Slurp
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:20 pm

Sun Apr 12, 2020 12:31 pm

twta500 wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 12:25 pm
Slurp wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 12:22 pm
I guess my experience has been different from everyone else's. I've never refrigerated teas and haven't noticed any loss of flavor in unopened vacuum or nitrogen filled packets even for many months after purchase.
How do you store your opened tea packages?
Airtight tea tins, but once opened I'll drink within 2 months or so, past that some start to lose flavour.
User avatar
Victoria
Admin
Posts: 3043
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 3:33 pm
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Contact:

Tue Apr 14, 2020 1:17 pm

Right, I agree past two months an open pack of Japanese green tea will be degraded, loosing it freshness if not refrigerated.
twta500 wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 12:25 pm
Victoria wrote:
Sat Apr 11, 2020 6:45 pm
twta500 wrote:
Sat Apr 11, 2020 3:14 pm
Do you think "investing" in a separate minifridge solely for tea would be worth it if I'm able to finish it all within a year?
Many people do this. If you have the room, I’d recommend doing that, even if you probably won’t use it all for tea. Those 100gram packs don’t take up much room. Less likelihood of garlic and fish aromas mingling with your teas. I like cooking and so there are interesting scents milling around in there. That’s why I use those odor moisture proof hunting bags, just in case there would be any transference. Currently, I use a lower fruit bin for teas, more than enough room.
Do you think a ziplock freezer bag will be good enough for unopened tea packages if I have a minifridge solely for storing tea?
If yes, basically:
Unopened: Put unopened tea package into ziplock, push out air + throw in an oxygen absorber, and put into fridge.
Opened: Put opened tea package into canning jar, remove air, put into frige

Will I run into any condensation issues for constantly taking out and re-refrigerating the opened tea inside a canning jar?
I would test the freezer ziplock bag to see how airtight it is by filling 1/4 with water, hang it upside down overnight, and see if any water has leaked out. Some seals are better than others, that’s why I use odor and moisture proof Loksak Opsak camping ziplock bags, they have thicker wider seals. I also sometimes place packs inside a mylar bag to seal out light. I’m going to ask a few vendors how they refrigerate their packs and get back to you. I don’t think an oxygen absorber is necessary inside the ziplock.

@debunix can answer the canning jar question better than I since I haven't tried this yet. I would think if you have an open pack inside the airtight canning jar, that you’d want to minimize breaking the seal. It probably depends on how much moisture is in the leaf to begin with. Would be interesting to see research on moisture content of different teas.
User avatar
debunix
Posts: 1812
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:27 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:39 pm

I can only tell you what I do with my tea, which is leave one package at a time out and open, a quantity that I can finish in 2-3 weeks max. I only resorted to the canning jar because necessity for comparison tasting required multiple packages to be open at once. I have vacuum-sealed portions of tea to chill separately when the whole package was too large to finish in less than a month. I have never opened/closed a refrigerated & sealed jar repeatedly close together, but I would expect condensation damage, plus the vacuum sealing takes electricity and I'd feel bad about climate change impact doing it daily.
User avatar
Tor
Posts: 108
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 6:19 am
Location: Bangkok

Tue Apr 14, 2020 3:33 pm

debunix wrote:
Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:39 pm
... plus the vacuum sealing takes electricity and I'd feel bad about climate change impact doing it daily.
:roll:

After I read your post I looked at the back of my sealer and found that it’s 150W. It takes roughly 10 sec to seal a pack. In contrast, my Bonavita is rated at 1000W. :lol:
Hengchan
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Jul 03, 2019 6:57 am
Location: UK

Tue Apr 14, 2020 5:21 pm

What about if you keep the whole operation inside the fridge. I.e transfer the leaves into the brewing vessel in the fridge. Rather than taking the pack out to normal air temps and opening it there.

Wouldn't this reduce the effect of warm air entering the package? You will have the fridge door open tho so have to do it quickly.

Tell me if this is just a dumb idea :lol: !
User avatar
debunix
Posts: 1812
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:27 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Wed Apr 15, 2020 10:22 am

I am content with the quality of my sencha and gyokuro packs that are kept continuously at room temp once the bag is open, except for very limited circumstances. Yes, it may take more energy to heat the water than to reseal a canning jar with tea in it, but one is a necessary act if I am going to enjoy tea, and one simply is not.

Like anyone else, I have some habits that are more energy wasting than others, but I do look for opportunities to make small positive differences too, including not using energy-intensive resealing techniques where I will easily enjoy the tea before being at room temp degrades it much; and being content with slow surface shipments where offered by shippers.
LuckyMe
Posts: 110
Joined: Thu May 02, 2019 3:17 pm
Location: Chicago
Contact:

Fri Apr 17, 2020 7:00 am

Victoria wrote:
Fri Apr 10, 2020 3:27 pm
I also know a few Japanese matcha drinkers who freeze their matcha, taking out what they need, and putting canister back into freezer. I haven’t tried this though with matcha or any other tea.

I have though been refrigerating Sincha, Sencha and Gyokuro for over a decade and have done a few experiments comparing refrigerator vs fresh with varying results. If I will not open a pack in the next month or so, I will refrigerate the unopened pack to keep it fresh. When taking a pack out, I’ll wait 24hrs to get it to room temperature, open, seal, wait another 12hrs for leaves to open a bit. Most Japanese greens refrigerate well within the first three years, after that it hit or miss with Sincha and Sencha, Gyokuro does better. Most important when refrigerating is that an odor proof and moisture proof bag or container is used. I’ve had great success with Lopsak Opsak hunting bags. I only store unopened bags and haven’t experimented with freezing yet which maybe I should. This morning I was sipping on a Sincha refrigerated six years, it’s pretty good still, but not as good as fresh. Last week, I enjoyed a Gyokuro that had been refrigerated three years, excellent, and a Sencha that was refrigerated six years that was also excellent. So some Japanese greens do better than others with long term storage it seems.
This is pretty much how I refrigerate my sencha and Chinese greens. I portion tea into foil ziplock pouches which are airtight, double bag, and place them in the coldest part of the fridge. After removing from the fridge, I wait 24 hours before opening to avoid condensation issues and to allow the leaves time to come to room temperature. Japanese greens seem to do best with cold storage. I've had a few Chinese greens go off on me but I don't know if that's simply due to age or the effects of refrigeration. For the part most though, refrigerating tea seems to help preserve freshness so I'll continue storing my greens this way.

I have not tried freezing matcha but that may be worth a shot seeing as how matcha seems to degrade more quickly than regular tea.
Post Reply