Tea “Poisoning”

User avatar
Baisao
Posts: 1397
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 5:17 pm
Location: ATX

Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:57 pm

Stephen wrote:
Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:13 pm
Here's a post about it. There might be other posts as well.
http://mattchasblog.blogspot.com/2017/0 ... i-and.html
Thank you for sharing this. I like that notion of Evil Qi. I’ve never had allergic reactions like he is describing but I have definitely had teas that make me feel yucky. I don’t think this phenomenon is limited to agrochemicals. I think tea can be poorly processed or stored and develop chemicals that make us feel unwell.
User avatar
Baisao
Posts: 1397
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 5:17 pm
Location: ATX

Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:01 pm

Teachronicles wrote:
Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:09 pm
I've only experienced this with raw puer, usually aged. The sensation is pretty consistently a racing heart (separate from the caffeinated sensation) and often a tightness or extreme warmth in the chest. Usually I quit the tea right there and just ride it out hah. Sorry, that's all I've found to really get rid of it, time. My gut says having food and/or drinking something with electrolytes/minerals might help. Exercise, as someone mentioned, always helped me feel better after a heavy night of drinking, when I used to drink.

Edit:. I've actually also experienced it with an "aged" oolong that gave a definite feeling of being poisoned. I figured it was heavy pesticide use.
I haven’t had either from good aged sheng or aged oolong. I do get the sensations you described from young sheng. With one wild maocha my heart was racing many hours after the caffeine had worn off. I had a creepy crawly feeling all over, late into the night. Wild teas are higher in photochemicals (for protecting against fungi and insects) and seem to have more psychoactive properties. Any of those chemicals might not feel right to any given person.
Last edited by Baisao on Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
mudandleaves
Vendor
Posts: 326
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:50 pm
Location: Guangzhou, China/Ottawa
Contact:

Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:14 pm

Teachronicles wrote:
Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:09 pm
I've only experienced this with raw puer, usually aged. The sensation is pretty consistently a racing heart (separate from the caffeinated sensation) and often a tightness or extreme warmth in the chest. Usually I quit the tea right there and just ride it out hah. Sorry, that's all I've found to really get rid of it, time. My gut says having food and/or drinking something with electrolytes/minerals might help. Exercise, as someone mentioned, always helped me feel better after a heavy night of drinking, when I used to drink.

Edit:. I've actually also experienced it with an "aged" oolong that gave a definite feeling of being poisoned. I figured it was heavy pesticide use.
I've had the experience of too much nervous energy, heart racing, etc. from Sheng, which can be very potent; this is usually after having way too much or drinking it on an empty stomach.

My worst experience, and the only one I'm fairly certain was from chemicals, was drinking tieguanyin in a tea market. There is a lot of truly terribly stuff being passed off as tieguanyin in China.
User avatar
Baisao
Posts: 1397
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 5:17 pm
Location: ATX

Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:28 pm

mudandleaves wrote:
Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:14 pm
Teachronicles wrote:
Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:09 pm
I've only experienced this with raw puer, usually aged. The sensation is pretty consistently a racing heart (separate from the caffeinated sensation) and often a tightness or extreme warmth in the chest. Usually I quit the tea right there and just ride it out hah. Sorry, that's all I've found to really get rid of it, time. My gut says having food and/or drinking something with electrolytes/minerals might help. Exercise, as someone mentioned, always helped me feel better after a heavy night of drinking, when I used to drink.

Edit:. I've actually also experienced it with an "aged" oolong that gave a definite feeling of being poisoned. I figured it was heavy pesticide use.
I've had the experience of too much nervous energy, heart racing, etc. from Sheng, which can be very potent; this is usually after having way too much or drinking it on an empty stomach.

My worst experience, and the only one I'm fairly certain was from chemicals, was drinking tieguanyin in a tea market. There is a lot of truly terribly stuff being passed off as tieguanyin in China.
“Ride the snake!”

Image
User avatar
mudandleaves
Vendor
Posts: 326
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:50 pm
Location: Guangzhou, China/Ottawa
Contact:

Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:31 pm

Baisao wrote:
Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:28 pm
mudandleaves wrote:
Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:14 pm
Teachronicles wrote:
Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:09 pm
I've only experienced this with raw puer, usually aged. The sensation is pretty consistently a racing heart (separate from the caffeinated sensation) and often a tightness or extreme warmth in the chest. Usually I quit the tea right there and just ride it out hah. Sorry, that's all I've found to really get rid of it, time. My gut says having food and/or drinking something with electrolytes/minerals might help. Exercise, as someone mentioned, always helped me feel better after a heavy night of drinking, when I used to drink.

Edit:. I've actually also experienced it with an "aged" oolong that gave a definite feeling of being poisoned. I figured it was heavy pesticide use.
I've had the experience of too much nervous energy, heart racing, etc. from Sheng, which can be very potent; this is usually after having way too much or drinking it on an empty stomach.

My worst experience, and the only one I'm fairly certain was from chemicals, was drinking tieguanyin in a tea market. There is a lot of truly terribly stuff being passed off as tieguanyin in China.
“Ride the snake!”

Image
:lol:
User avatar
wave_code
Posts: 575
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2018 2:10 pm
Location: Germany

Tue Mar 26, 2019 4:15 am

I've had a couple of liu bao teas that have given me a bit of an unhappy stomach, although it usually fades within a couple of hours. Most likely I just didn't give them a strong enough wash. As long as you know the tea is or should be clean of chemicals with fermented teas I also sometimes wonder if its like an inoculation process almost like drinking campground water if you have only ever had treated city water before- the first time maybe your body reacts unfavorably since some new microbes might be being introduced causing your immune system to go on alert, but evert time after that you are fine.

As for pesticides, its amazing how what were once inaccessible lab processes are now reasonably affordable. While still not as cheap as a radio, portable DNA sequencers exist that could be accessible financially to someone who would be considered just a hobbyist or consumer rather than a lab with a significant research budget (for better or worse..). While not as accurate or sterile as a lab process since the user may not know or observe protocol, I wonder if similar things already do exist or could soon exist for easier testing for pesticides on at least a basic level so you wouldn't always have to send off to a lab and pay/wait to find out.
Ethan Kurland
Vendor
Posts: 1026
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2017 1:01 am
Location: Boston
Contact:

Wed Mar 27, 2019 8:58 pm

Baisao wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:18 pm
It was tasty at first. However, at about the 4th steeping it changed dramatically...p it went from Athena to Gorgon.
I went to a dictionary to learn "Gorgon" can be any of 3 women of Greek myths with snakes for hair who turn people into stone if gazed upon. I commend you on your writing! Beautiful turn of phrase used in account of getting sick---great!

Cheers
User avatar
Baisao
Posts: 1397
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 5:17 pm
Location: ATX

Thu Mar 28, 2019 2:49 pm

Ethan Kurland wrote:
Wed Mar 27, 2019 8:58 pm
Baisao wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:18 pm
It was tasty at first. However, at about the 4th steeping it changed dramatically...p it went from Athena to Gorgon.
I went to a dictionary to learn "Gorgon" can be any of 3 women of Greek myths with snakes for hair who turn people into stone if gazed upon. I commend you on your writing! Beautiful turn of phrase used in account of getting sick---great!

Cheers
Thank you very much, Ethan. That was literally what went through my head at the time so I am glad I captured it in the description.
User avatar
OCTO
Posts: 1120
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2018 6:25 pm
Location: Penang, Malaysia

Thu Mar 28, 2019 6:48 pm

@Baisao

Was the tea a freshly harvested or aged tea?

Cupping reveals a lot about a tea. It’s a simple process which many chose to ignore... but it’s a crucial part of learning and knowing more about your tea.

I would say, brewing with a teapot should only begin when you have known your tea and want to get more “intimate with deeper understanding” of your tea.

Cheers!
User avatar
Victoria
Admin
Posts: 3043
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 3:33 pm
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Contact:

Thu Mar 28, 2019 6:57 pm

@OCTO can you share how you are cupping?
User avatar
Baisao
Posts: 1397
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 5:17 pm
Location: ATX

Thu Mar 28, 2019 9:10 pm

OCTO wrote:
Thu Mar 28, 2019 6:48 pm
Baisao

Was the tea a freshly harvested or aged tea?

Cupping reveals a lot about a tea. It’s a simple process which many chose to ignore... but it’s a crucial part of learning and knowing more about your tea.

I would say, brewing with a teapot should only begin when you have known your tea and want to get more “intimate with deeper understanding” of your tea.

Cheers!
It was supposed to be a recently made Dong Ding but it had mixed into it what looked to me to be old (and foul) leaves in it. I say this because they were reluctant to open, like aged oolong.

That’s good to hear about cupping. I think I’ll do it more frequently. I didn’t have enough leaves in this sample to do 2 sessions, one for cupping the other for teapot brewing.
User avatar
OCTO
Posts: 1120
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2018 6:25 pm
Location: Penang, Malaysia

Thu Mar 28, 2019 10:57 pm

Victoria wrote:
Thu Mar 28, 2019 6:57 pm
OCTO can you share how you are cupping?
@Victoria here are some photos on how I do cupping.

Cheers!
16D84C23-E37C-44E8-836D-468484E52835.jpeg
16D84C23-E37C-44E8-836D-468484E52835.jpeg (322.92 KiB) Viewed 6532 times
05A6491C-3269-42E4-9316-627048C88A3B.jpeg
05A6491C-3269-42E4-9316-627048C88A3B.jpeg (312.83 KiB) Viewed 6532 times
69DF4208-6D7D-4F15-B02E-D52070684BD7.jpeg
69DF4208-6D7D-4F15-B02E-D52070684BD7.jpeg (157.51 KiB) Viewed 6532 times
oolongfan
Posts: 156
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:40 am
Location: Indiana, USA

Thu May 30, 2019 11:02 pm

@Baisao - What an awful sounding experience..especially since the tea turned on you so quickly. Did you try the tea several times before this happened..or since?

I have kidney disease,thyroid, and adrenal issues...sometimes when I overload my body with too much stress caffeine, not enough wate..and so forth, my taste sometimes seems off....but again this might just be unique to me due to my health (or lack thereof). Even on my worst health day I have never had the reaction that you did..but then I have not run into such mean tea - yet ;)

I wonder if there exists such a thing as tea posioning...like food posioning where somehwhere along the line, the tea was not processed correctly, the plants electrolyte, sugars and so forth were at unaturel levles. the state of the tea plant when the leaves were harvested...and as a result the tea became toxic/unhealthy to consume. For example, Spring grass can develope elevated sugars, especially in the morning -which can lead to colick in some horses when consumed freely. Vets suggest not turning your horse out to graze until the mid afternoon, by which time the grass sugar levels have dropped. So while there is no 'toxin' in the grass, the elevated sugars can be a problem for certain metabolic types when consumed in large quantities. So while a far removed example this is...tea is made from plants..so I wonder if such considerations exist when harvesting tea leaves...not to mention processing issues.

I have never experienced evil qi yet, thankfully. What you describe sounds almost like an allergic stress reaction. I don't wonder if your cortisol levels spiked as a result. Elevated cortisol causes inflammation...the latter might have stayed with you for a while. I developed elevated cortisol last year, and the symptoms have been anything from elevated pulse, feeling very hot and panicky, exhausted, very achey, hangover exhaustion yet wired, no appetite for normal food-only sugar. Even a healthy body can really be stressed over certain things liek pesticides or something just not agreeing with the body.

Everyone has made great suggestions...i would second hydration, maybe stretching, going for a walk...maybe pick up an adrenal adaptogen suppliment like Rhodiola and see if taking it helps your body recover in the semi long term. Sorry you had such a bad time of things.
User avatar
Bok
Vendor
Posts: 5782
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:55 am
Location: Taiwan

Fri May 31, 2019 12:06 am

oolongfan wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 11:02 pm
..so I wonder if such considerations exist when harvesting tea leaves...not to mention processing issues.
They do, yet mostly to maximise flavour, leaves are harvested at certain times of the day.
User avatar
pantry
Posts: 389
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:34 am
Location: US East Coast

Fri May 31, 2019 2:02 am

@OCTO Very nice looking setup! Were these sold as cupping set, or did you mix and match yourself?
Post Reply