Longevity of Tea Leaves: Sustaining Multiple Steeps

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Victoria
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Thu Aug 30, 2018 10:17 pm

I've been thinking about different teas ability to sustain multiple steeps. Why some teas steep for several days, while others do not. Thickness of leaf might have something to do with this, but not always. Wild old growth trees, with deeper roots, seem to generally produce teas with greater longevity. How does the type of cultivar, soil, microclimate, and processing factor into a tea's longevity? Which teas have you found to steep the longest? What has been your experience?

Some general observations (still mulling over these):
Thicker or older leaves are generally more resilient and may steep 6+ times. Examples of this are High Mountain oolongs: FuShouShan, Winter LiShan and DaYuLing. Higher quality Taiwan teas have greater resistance and will steep longer, at least 6 times, some for several days.

Pu'erh sourced from old growth trees more frequently steeps longer and with greater depth. Fermentation may also extend steeping, but it seems to depend more on the source of the tea.

Levels of fermentation, oxidation, roasting may also further contribute to longevity of steeping.

Young delicate greener leaves, like those found in Japanese teas, only steeps well 3-5 times. Shincha and Gyokuro's fine new buds are broken during processing so flavor is extracted very quickly, up front.

A few teas I have steeped for several days, sometimes into a week;
  • Origin Tea, 'Hualien Mixiang Red Tea' -small leaves first three, high oxidation/medium roast.
  • Essence of Tea, 'Half Hand Made 2014 Rou Gui' Wuyi oolong - high oxidation/medium roast.
  • ‘FuShoushan’ - very thick large leaves, low oxidation/low roast.
  • Origin, '1995 Mengku Ye-Sheng-Da-Ye' Raw Puerh Cake - aged whole leaves/high fermentation oxidation.
  • Floating Leaves, ‘2014 Bai Hao’ PingLin oolong -twisted white tip medium oxidation.

Center; Hualien Mixiang Red Tea's very small oxidized roasted leaves. Upper right; Gyokuro's young leaves broken. Periphery; FuShoushan's very thick large leaves.
Hualien Mixiang Red Tea, FuShouShan, Yame Gyokuro L1010131_.jpg
Hualien Mixiang Red Tea, FuShouShan, Yame Gyokuro L1010131_.jpg (560.57 KiB) Viewed 8354 times
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Tillerman
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Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:06 pm

Victoria wrote:
Thu Aug 30, 2018 10:17 pm
I've been thinking about different teas ability to sustain multiple steeps across several days. Why some teas steep for several days, while others do not. Thickness of leaf might have something to do with this, but not always. Wild old growth trees, with deeper roots, seem to generally produce teas with greater longevity. How does the type of cultivar, soil, microclimate, and processing factor into a tea's longevity? Which teas have you found to steep the longest? What has been your experience?
Hi Victoria,

I firmly believe that "number of steeps" is essentially an irrelevant figure that mostly is misused and exaggerated by tea vendors to entice customers to their teas. The number of steeps will vary not just by tea but by the individual doing the brewing. I. for example, rarely steep my Taiwan oolongs more than 4 or 5 times for I find the flavor and balance gone by that point (and this includes Fushoushan. Lishan, DYL etc.) The number of steeps depends not only on the character of the leaf but on how much extraction there is in each brew: the more that is extracted early, the less available for later steepings. I would rather 1 or 2 fine cups than a raft of lesser ones: quality vs. quantity.
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Victoria
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Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:41 pm

Tillerman wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:06 pm
Hi Victoria,

I firmly believe that "number of steeps" is essentially an irrelevant figure that mostly is misused and exaggerated by tea vendors to entice customers to their teas. The number of steeps will vary not just by tea but by the individual doing the brewing. I. for example, rarely steep my Taiwan oolongs more than 4 or 5 times for I find the flavor and balance gone by that point (and this includes Fushoushan. Lishan, DYL etc.) The number of steeps depends not only on the character of the leaf but on how much extraction there is in each brew: the more that is extracted early, the less available for later steepings. I would rather 1 or 2 fine cups than a raft of lesser ones: quality vs. quantity.
Good to hear from you and get your input. I can see how a vendor might capitalize on this as a concept, although I’m not a vendor and not trying to sell anything other than inquiry. I have noticed my vendor friends are not so interested in multi-steeping in general, this may be because they are sampling so many teas and have a constant influx of new teas. Extended multi-day steeps could bury them pretty quickly :).

I agree that the number of quality steeps will vary depending on how a particular tea is being brewed; leaf quantity to water ratio/heat/duration of steep.
Yet, certain teas steep longer than others. This isn’t a matter of personal preference, or technique, it is coming from the characteristics of the leaf itself and then how it is processed. My query is more focused on investigating what attributes of a leaf (aside from steeping techniques) may lead to steeping longevity or lack of.

As an example, during a recent tasting I shared what I consider to be one of my finest teas, Origin Tea’s 'Hualien Mixiang Red Tea', steeped in a 90ml F1 Zisha pot with 4gr of leaf/under boil/40 seconds, 30,40sec,1min,1.5,2,3,4,8,16,30min,1hr,3hr,6hr, overnight, all day, for 5 more days of long steeps. The first two steeps were too strong, less leaf could have been used, or flash steeps. Subsequent steeps were perfect, rich and deep. The leaves are so tiny, it amazed me that leaves so young and small could continue to offer so much flavor over so many days. Hualian County, where this tea was grown and produced, is famous for its red teas, plus the age of this tea (4 +years), may be contributing to its longevity and very high quality. These little leaves steep longer and stronger than the much larger and thicker FuShoushan.
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Fri Aug 31, 2018 7:47 pm

Tillerman wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:06 pm
Victoria wrote:
Thu Aug 30, 2018 10:17 pm
Which teas have you found to steep the longest? What has been your experience?
Hi Victoria,

I firmly believe that "number of steeps" is essentially an irrelevant figure that mostly is misused and exaggerated by tea vendors to entice customers .... I. for example, rarely steep my Taiwan oolongs more than 4 or 5 times for I find the flavor and balance gone by that point (and this includes Fushoushan. Lishan, DYL etc.) The number of steeps depends not only on the character of the leaf but on how much extraction there is in each brew: the more that is extracted early, the less available for later steepings. I would rather 1 or 2 fine cups than a raft of lesser ones: quality vs. quantity.
Victoria, Your ? makes me realize that although I notice how many infusions leaves give me in a session or over a day or two, that I never use leaves more than 2 days. Although I like drinking 3 or so teas a day, I do not think I would want or need to keep used leaves around to ever learn how durable they are over more than 2 days. I assumed it is pushing leaves too hard.

Tillerman, I often tell people who are not used to buying good tea about multiple infusions. It often comes off badly, as if they hear me say that the tea was not so delicious but at least one gets to use the leaves more than once. Also, I have introduced quality tea to a few people who have never used leaves more than once though I have told them more than once that they could. I wish that I could entice sales with the fact that leaves can be used more than once. I wish my words meant more....

Paying more for tea than what is comfortable for me, is much easier to do if the cost per cup will not be increased as much as the cost per gram of dry leaves. Foushoushan that I drink costs me more than 3 X the cost of simular gaoshan, that I like very much. The FSS being better would be not enough for me to buy it. Getting 7 infusions rather than 3, makes the FSS a sensible enough purchase for me.

I suppose one can only say what he finds to work best. One "suggests" how to prepare, knowing people vary in their reactions etc. I usually am using a modest amount of leaves to produce 2 to 4 "fine cups" as you say, rather than many lesser ones, but many people use more leaves than I do.. I try to remember that, different practices don't always result in better or worse brews, just different.....

The dayuling that I have is not worth its price to me if I prepare it Western style & hardly makes sense to have in my cupboard unless I employ gongfu preparation. Then the DYL comes into its own being tasty enough and very interesting as it changes over the infusions, and is okay economically. I am trying to say that number of infusions matter to me but it that the issue is tricky. Cheers
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Sat Sep 01, 2018 12:39 am

Victoria wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:41 pm
Tillerman wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:06 pm
Hi Victoria,

I firmly believe that "number of steeps" is essentially an irrelevant figure that mostly is misused and exaggerated by tea vendors to entice customers to their teas. The number of steeps will vary not just by tea but by the individual doing the brewing. I. for example, rarely steep my Taiwan oolongs more than 4 or 5 times for I find the flavor and balance gone by that point (and this includes Fushoushan. Lishan, DYL etc.) The number of steeps depends not only on the character of the leaf but on how much extraction there is in each brew: the more that is extracted early, the less available for later steepings. I would rather 1 or 2 fine cups than a raft of lesser ones: quality vs. quantity.
Good to hear from you and get your input. I can see how a vendor might capitalize on this as a concept, although I’m not a vendor and not trying to sell anything other than inquiry. I have noticed my vendor friends are not so interested in multi-steeping in general, this may be because they are sampling so many teas and have a constant influx of new teas. Extended multi-day steeps could bury them pretty quickly :).

I agree that the number of quality steeps will vary depending on how a particular tea is being brewed; leaf quantity to water ratio/heat/duration of steep.
Yet, certain teas steep longer than others. This isn’t a matter of personal preference, or technique, it is coming from the characteristics of the leaf itself and then how it is processed. My query is more focused on investigating what attributes of a leaf (aside from steeping techniques) may lead to steeping longevity or lack of.

As an example, during a recent tasting I shared what I consider to be one of my finest teas, Origin Tea’s 'Hualien Mixiang Red Tea', steeped in a 90ml F1 Zisha pot with 4gr of leaf/under boil/40 seconds, 30,40sec,1min,1.5,2,3,4,8,16,30min,1hr,3hr,6hr, overnight, all day, for 5 more days of long steeps. The first two steeps were too strong, less leaf could have been used, or flash steeps. Subsequent steeps were perfect, rich and deep. The leaves are so tiny, it amazed me that leaves so young and small could continue to offer so much flavor over so many days. Hualian County, where this tea was grown and produced, is famous for its red teas, plus the age of this tea (4 +years), may be contributing to its longevity and very high quality. These little leaves steep longer and stronger than the much larger and thicker FuShoushan.
I'm not sure what characteristics allow a tea leaf to sustain multiple steepings, but as you have experienced with some Floating Tea's tea leaves, I've also been able to steep many of their leaves overnight and also for a day, and still extract tea from the leaves. Their Oriental Beauty definitely could be steep overnight or a day after already being steeped multiple times before. I've never tried 5 or more days with any leaves, assuming that that they would go bad by that time. Not sure when I got into the habit of steeping leaves over a long period, but I probably learned about it somewhere. Sometimes other characteristics are revealed.
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Sat Sep 01, 2018 2:58 am

In the hot and humid weather here in Penang where it’s Summer all year round, generally we don’t steep tea overnight for consumption. They would usually turn bad after 8 hours. Could be less. I would steep tea overnight to season my pot. Nothing more than that.

Some would store brewed tea leaves in the refrigerator to prevent it from turning bad. Then will slow brew it over a cozy or candle burner to extract what’s left in the tea. Usually only applicable to aged tea. Never on young tea.

Cheers!
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Victoria
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Sun Sep 02, 2018 12:39 pm

OCTO, yes makes sense that hot humid conditions will encourage microbial growth. I can see why you would be cautious with multi-day steeps under those conditions. My original post though was an inquiry as to why particular leaves sustain multiple steeps, while others don’t. More a question of the leaf’s characteristics, rather than if we should steep multiple times ;) .
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Sun Sep 02, 2018 12:48 pm

So much depends on how I brew.....if I put a little more tea in the pot or shiboridashi than usual, if I run out of time for the usual sequence of shorter steeps, if the tea just isn't done and is worth that last steep, if I know I will appreciate even a very dilute but still tea-ish drink when I get home or wake up, or it this particular tea session is giving pleasing 'sweet water' at the end....there are lots of reasons for that final steep or steeps, and only one of them really is about the leaf surprising me with its 'staying power'.

This morning, I set some Red Alishan oolong from Norbu on to steep yet again, because these small, tightly furled, deeply oxidized and roasted leaves just have a lot of stamina, and as I usually prepare it, I get 6-8 steeps out of the leaves in a continuous session, with the pot filled; this will be maybe the 6th, but I used less leaf; the 5th and 6th will be overnight/all day infusions.

I expect perhaps 4 steeps from my Earth Sencha from Obubu, and will fill the shibo with cool water for a last multi-hour steep, because this sencha has more sweet and less bitter in the end infusions, and I expect I will find a sip of this refreshing after drinking lots of plain water while working in my garden today.

At one workplace, where I'm only there a few days a month and my storage is limited, but my days there may be 12-14 hours, I keep a single teapot and teacup, and it's an extremely dry environment, so my steeps are limited by the need to keep hydrated, and I often stop well before I otherwise would because I am thirsty and can't tie up my sole pot with a last 20 minute or 2 hour steep....even if the leaves are not 'done'.

Multiple steeps aren't just about the leaf.....but it does take the right leaf (that doesn't just get more bitter with long steeping) and setting (enough teaware and other options for hydration) to go on and on with a single tea.
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Sun Sep 02, 2018 6:49 pm

In my long (I hope not terribly long) post, I forgot something that prompted me to reply: If an hour or more will pass between infusions, I spread the wet tea out on a plate to get air. I have often found liquid in a pot that I thought had been emptied of fluids and even found pearls holding liquid inside. I do this to avoid bitterness or whatever else can ruin future infusions. Sometimes I play with the leaves, removing some hard stems or bits I find unappealing.
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Mon Sep 03, 2018 11:06 am

After enjoying some really quite lovely kukicha from Japan, I do not bother trying to pull out stems anymore; some of them may be contributing flavor, and if I enjoyed the prior infusions enough to want more, I leave them in there.
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Mon Sep 03, 2018 11:45 am

debunix wrote:
Mon Sep 03, 2018 11:06 am
.... I do not bother trying to pull out stems anymore; some of them may be contributing flavor, and if I enjoyed the prior infusions enough to want more, I leave them in there.
Honestly, I do not know that removing stems or even a leaf that looks like a weed changes taste at all. I do it sometimes while the kettle is heating water. If I am preparing a last infusion & notice that a pearl has remained tightly shut, I like to open it. Sometimes there is something gritty inside rolled tea. The grit seems like stems that somehow got ground. (Perhaps sap from broken down stems kept the pearl stuck together.) Perhaps I will find an earring from a tea farmer inside a pearl one day! Cheers
Note: It is encouraging that with all the tea that I have inspected before & after leaves were used, it is very rare that something seems amiss. I rarely find something that looks out of place; nothing like the small pebbles that I find in whole grains that I eat.
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debunix
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Mon Sep 03, 2018 11:51 am

Ethan Kurland wrote:
Mon Sep 03, 2018 11:45 am
nothing like the small pebbles that I find in whole grains that I eat.
Rock taste tea!

I work a lot with whole grains--I mill my own flour, and have discovered I need to screen most wheat and some other grains for stones etc before I put it into my mills. Some batches are 'rockier' than others.....but my experience is similar, much less concern for stones in my tea.
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Wed Sep 05, 2018 4:42 am

Ethan Kurland wrote:
Sun Sep 02, 2018 6:49 pm
If an hour or more will pass between infusions, I spread the wet tea out on a plate to get air. I have often found liquid in a pot that I thought had been emptied of fluids and even found pearls holding liquid inside. I do this to avoid bitterness or whatever else can ruin future infusions.
I have an opposite experience for the most part, I find the wet leaf tends to oxidize somewhat when left to open air like that in a way that maximizes exposure, sometimes it develops a bit of a fishy taste whereas Ive found it keeping most of its properties (at least for longer) when kept inside the teapot.
That said most my tea sessions are drank in the first act, with an overnight steep or a few multiple hours steeps throughout the day if started in the morning to finish it up, very rarely do I leave the wet leaf 'dry' for hours so my experience wasnt replicated enough times to be representative.
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Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:14 am

I believe that how many times particular tea can be steeped is quite individual. As that all depends on many factors starting from the amount of tea brewed, size of the brewing vessel , times of each steeping and the most importantly....individual tolerance of the taste. ( means when you decide that the tea is not giving what it should so that is the particular the last infusion ).
Mentioned oxidized or fermented teas don't necessarily have to give more infusions since your mouth might be quite influenced by intensive flavor of the green leaf post processing. Means , if I start to drink tea with you after 5th infusion , when you still feel some sweetness , to me it might be quite dull. I experience it often when come to the tea shop in the middle of the tea session. Everybody sitting happy but I drink "colored tasteless water".
Yes, in pu-erh tea the older trees have longer lasting sheng jing and deeper hui gan , also can be brewed much longer than tai di cha ( bush tea ) .
Vendors use sometimes numbers of infusions only for the rough reference to express if tea is just quick daily drinker or suitable for longer sessions . It's up to buyer to buy a sample first and see / drink if his or hers taste tolerance is similar with the vendor's. Same applies with other descriptions in online tea shops.
Usually oolong teas don't last many infusions , however it can provide few cups of real happiness ( as mentioned above..quality vs quantity ) . Some Dancong tea I would steep 4-6 times and feel it's getting dull, but my friend can get 10+ infusions out of that calling me how amazing session he just had :-D
...so my opinion ...it's very individual
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Sun Sep 09, 2018 3:32 am

As a general rule, better quality tea can be steeped more times than other teas of the same type. I no longer overnight brew (I haven't done that for several years), and I try not to leave tea overnight as often it seems to lose a lot after the overnight rest. Some teas just die if left overnight (sans water), while others hold up very well.

In my early days, I did overnight steeps often, but as the years go buy, I often no longer steep teas out to the end. Especially since I'm a vendor...I often drink a new tea every day!

Many Chinese tea drinkers (ethnically Chinese) absolutely will not do leave tea overnight, or do overnight steeps, and consider it unhealthy. I don't think microbes are their concern either, although when I do leave leaves in a pot overnight, I don't usually notice any off flavors. Leaving tea (sans water) in a pot for 36 hours + and I do notice it start to get funky, though! Wet leaves will go bad if left long enough. They're already wet, so I don't think humidity will influence that much. Temperature will affect the type of microbes that are prevalent, though, since they have peak temperature ranges for activity.

A friend and I had a six-tea session yesterday, so I continued with the tea today, since I had three pots full of leaves on the coffee (tea?) table. They held up well overnight.
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