When did the number of steeps start increasing for gongfu and why?

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mbanu
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Fri Mar 19, 2021 11:59 am

I had thought maybe this was a Taiwanese practice, but I happened across a nice gongfu book from 1999, A Passage to Chinese Tea written by a Taiwanese ex-pat in Malaysia who owns a teashop there, and he mentions that "normally, the same tea leaves may be used for three brewings." John Blofeld, describing the gongfu tea he had in Republican China, said, "There may be four infusions in all". In 2006, Chan Kam Pong, author of First Step to Chinese Puerh Tea, was advising gongfu pu'er tea with 15 steeps. So maybe a Hong Konger practice? A PRC practice? Or was this just a 2000s trend, where before that everyone only did a few steeps, and afterwards everyone did a lot of steeps?

Does anyone know the back-story on this?
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Victoria
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Fri Mar 19, 2021 12:08 pm

Isn't this simply because gongfu would be typically used to brew oolong, where after 3-4 steeps the taste/quality of brew would usually drop?
The practice of "gongfuing" puerh seems kind of recent (at least in the way it is widespread).
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Fri Mar 19, 2021 9:54 pm

I think it might have to do with the tea quality. An average Oolong might only last for 3-4 nice infusions max. Later, the Taiwanese Oolong processing and leaf quality has improved and they can have quite the stamina for good quality ones, so six would be average, with exceptional ones going for much longer.

Not that I agree with prescribed amounts of infusions at all, I say let the tea decide.
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wave_code
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Sat Mar 20, 2021 10:58 am

in regards to pu and gong fu, someone please correct me... but from what I understand the rise in popularity in Taiwan sort of marks the beginning of the modern 'gong fu' brewing style being applied that way. so, how was pu erh typically brewed previously? I'm guessing especially when only aged pu was drunk and probably storage was rougher/more traditional the tea you wouldn't have to use flash infusions because the tea would be aged and more mellow so you aren't fighting against the bitterness. also that earlier shu processing was lighter, so if you wanted it to resemble something closer to aged sheng rather than motor oil you also wouldn't have to steep so short.

the kind of market dominance/scene around modern pu-erh, especially here in the west, there is of course a really big focus on the teas longevity and it seems to serve as a benchmark to a lot of people of the teas quality, maybe for many more so than the actual quality of those brews for those who are just obsessed with the whole process of 'gong fu' and don't have that much experience. slowly it creeps more and more in to other types of teas. I feel I've seen a number of people who have seemed disappointed with what would otherwise be a pretty decent liu bao in my book, or writing it off as not as good as pu, including older liu bao, because they "give out fast". which, yes some do, but also its not meant to be brewed 15 times, although some of them can favor that.

I guess these things also start to form feedback loops- rapid/more steeping rises in popularity so the focus becomes on producing higher quality teas with more longevity, prices go up, quality goes up, but also as brewing styles change due to new markets and economics producers try to adapt to that too - like the introduction of shengs which are actually intended more for early consumption than only after 25 year aging, which I would guess means faster and therefore more steeps to cut down the astringency.
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mbanu
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Sun Mar 21, 2021 6:59 pm

A mainland description of Chaozhou-style gongfu, I'm assuming from the 1980s, from the 1990 All the Tea in China by Kit Chow and Ione Kramer:
In Chaozhou, up the coast from Guangzhou in Guangdong province, and in some other places, people like their tea made in the gongfu style (here meaning "brewed with great skill"). The tea set consists of a tiny pot and four handleless cups the size of a walnut half-shell. The best are of Yixing stoneware. The pot is filled half to three-fourths full of tea leaves, and then they are "rinsed" by pouring boiling water over them and immediately draining it off. The pot is then filled about seven-eighths full of boiling water. After one minute the beverage is poured into the cups. The first cup is sipped and savored for its aroma. The second, after the pot has had more water added, is the most flavorful, for by then the infusion has reached full strength. By the third, there is no more aroma, but the flavor is still good. Oolong is particularly suited to this style.
So I think maybe the suspicion that this practice of a high number of steeps started with pu'er in particular is probably correct, barring this being a Hong Konger oolong practice, as it seems not to have been a Taiwanese, Chaozhou, or Republican China gongfu practice to do more than 3 or 4 steeps, usually.

So where and when did the practice of gongfu brewing pu'er come from? I have seen mention in earlier books of gongfu brewing green tea rather than oolong, which I suppose could mean pu'er, maybe it grew out of this?

Taiwan was not really interested in pu'er before the 1990s, I believe, while Hong Kong was not really interested in Yixing (I don't think) until Vitasoy founder Lo Kwee-seong (K.S. Lo) started sponsoring Yixing exhibitions at the Flagstaff Museum of Tea Ware in the 1980s. However, I don't know much about how these pots were being used, or really how K.S. Lo got started with Yixing collecting, other than a quote from an article on him which in turn quotes a preface from one of the exhibition catalogs:
"I was walking along Queen’s Road one day in the early 1950s when passing by a show window, I noticed a large number of second-hand teapots on display. Once inside, I was so carried away that I bought over 30 of them on impulse," he wrote, "later, I came to know that those were Yixing teapots. The more I learned the deeper I got interested, until finally [collecting these wares] developed into a consuming passion." (https://asianartnewspaper.com/a-unique- ... llections/)
Were people in Hong Kong buying these teapots to use in the 1950s, or just to collect?
oeroe
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Wed Mar 24, 2021 11:17 am

I've often wished there was more sources to the history of Gongfucha. I've wondered about the number of steepings as well. There was an interesting article by Tsai Yizhe on a quite recent GTH issue about the history of gfc. He seemed to be of the opinion that the fascination with number "3" was a later development, though he was mainly interested in trying to figure out the history of three cups -style. He was arguing that three cup phenomenon was a later development, and earliest mentions of gfc describe that the cup amount varies. Later, apparently for symbolic reasons, three cups became a thing. Now, I think he mentioned the practice about three steepings as well. If Tsai is on right tracks here, it could be that the three steepings were also a symbolic thing which became prevalent at a certain time.
Tsai didn't seem to think that the matter can be explained conclusively, and I would agree: it seems that there aren't enough sources, and purely symbolic explanations don't feel satisfactory.

It could also be that the descriptions of few steepings simply weren't actually representative of the whole gongfucha, during those times. Maybe some were brewing few steepings, and some many. Maybe more affluent members of society would choose to only drink the first three steeps, while others would drink all steepings with any colour in them. In short, I'm wondering could it be that the "increased steepings" is an extrapolation from too few datapoints?
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Balthazar
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Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:21 pm

@oeroe: Interesting! I recall reading a poem years ago (but cannot remember who the author was) which said something about how only those consumed by greed will force more than three brews out of their leaves, drawing on what Confucius said about "the gentleman" only having a few bites of food before stopping (the virtue of moderation). There's also this, from the Story of the Stone's Miaoyu, who was even more strict: "一杯曰品,二杯为解渴,三杯就是饮驴了" (I can't find my English copy atm, but it's somewhere in chapter 41).
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LeoFox
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Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:39 pm

Balthazar wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 1:21 pm
oeroe: Interesting! I recall reading a poem years ago (but cannot remember who the author was) which said something about how only those consumed by greed will force more than three brews out of their leaves, drawing on what Confucius said about "the gentleman" only having a few bites of food before stopping (the virtue of moderation). There's also this, from the Story of the Stone's Miaoyu, who was even more strict: "一杯曰品,二杯为解渴,三杯就是饮驴了" (I can't find my English copy atm, but it's somewhere in chapter 41).
viewtopic.php?p=30078#p30078
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Balthazar
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Wed Mar 24, 2021 2:10 pm

Ah yes, I had a feeling the that section had been posted here. A senior moment! :mrgreen:
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mbanu
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Wed Mar 24, 2021 3:58 pm

oeroe wrote:
Wed Mar 24, 2021 11:17 am
It could also be that the descriptions of few steepings simply weren't actually representative of the whole gongfucha, during those times. Maybe some were brewing few steepings, and some many. Maybe more affluent members of society would choose to only drink the first three steeps, while others would drink all steepings with any colour in them. In short, I'm wondering could it be that the "increased steepings" is an extrapolation from too few datapoints?
Another thing that might have influenced this is that tea was rationed in China for many years after the industry was nationalized due to shortages, the struggle between selling tea overseas to bring in funds and consuming it at home, and the desire for everyone to have the chance to get tea. However, I don't have any info on how or if this would have influenced how people gongfu brew.
oeroe
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Thu Mar 25, 2021 2:56 am

mbanu's point about rationing is interesting. Elsewhere in Global Tea Hut, Wude has often written that one of the rationales behind gfc is frugality, and he is of the opinion that trying to increase tea's patience, getting more tea out of the leaves is an old thing. He doesn't give any written sources, so he's probably retelling oral histories his heard from various sources. Oral histories are oral histories, and I wouldn't base an academic paper on that, but it is interesting nonetheless.

My own anecdotal experience is, that if I drink one set of leaves for many steepings continuously, without a long break, I can brew many many steepings and still they feel satisfying and worthwhile. If, however, I have long breaks between steepings, I seem to feel that the tea has been steeped out much faster. I have speculated that this is probably partially due to the heat dynamics (if leaves have cooled down between steepings, I need to increase time more faster, getting into longer steepings earlier etc) and partially due to the fact that when tasting tea, steepings build on to the previous tastes present in the mouth. For me, the fifteenth steep of tea might still be tasty, but if someone just sat down, he'd think it's water.

Anyway, my experience has given some credibility to the idea that with continuous gfc session one can get more out of the leaves, and thus the frugality thesis doesn't feel impossible. So, if conditions have been such that they would call for frugality, whether we're talking about PRC era rationing or poorer households earlier time, it would make sense for people to steep leaves as many times as they can.

On the other hand, Balthazar's point about kongfuzian frugality, being satisfied with just three steepings, sounds like something which might be part of the tea customs of scholarly elite. In Tsai's article, some of the earliest written sources described gfc as the method "described by Luyu", which of course isn't accurate, but Lu was also writing that only few bowls/cups should be enough. So, while there isn't much solid evidence, for me it seems very possible that the "few steepings style" has been one, scholarly subgroup of gfc, while "let's ooze all colour out of these leaves" -style probably happened too.

..That said, the idea of three steepings seems to have been largely abandoned altogether as gfc became the universal "Chinese tea ceremony" or "Chinese tea brewing method", and mbanu's original question, why and how this happened, is still interesting. I'd guess the answer would be that the rationale behind 3 steepings was now longer relevant.
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Thu Mar 25, 2021 4:01 am

There is a saying to leave a party when it’s best, which also applies to tea in some way. I often stop before the leaves are completely spent, simply because I want to end on a high note and with a nice taste still lingering in my mouth. And I have enough tea not to feel the need to be frugal.
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bliss
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Thu Mar 25, 2021 4:51 am

Bok wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 4:01 am
There is a saying to leave a party when it’s best, which also applies to tea in some way. I often stop before the leaves are completely spent, simply because I want to end on a high note and with a nice taste still lingering in my mouth. And I have enough tea not to feel the need to be frugal.
Good point. I think this is part of getting to know a tea. Knowing when to stop.

Regarding quality though, there is something romantic about a tea that you love and you just steep it until it becomes sweet water. I make some distinction between those teas and the sort of abrupt end you get with some teas that just break down completely beyond a certain point and the extraction is awful (a bunch of puer factory teas come to mind). I agree that the quality of infusions is the most important though, not longevity for longevity's sake. If an inexpensive tea offers 2-3 real quality infusions, that's a great tea to have up one's sleeve.
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Thu Mar 25, 2021 5:31 am

Out of curiosity, does anybody know how most avid tea drinkers used small zhu ni pots during the Qing dynasty?

Those pots now seem to be ideal for brewing yan cha to me, stuffed with leaves and brewed until they run out of essence (or old liu an...), but I'd be grateful to learn how they were in fact used back then.

Andrew
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Thu Mar 25, 2021 6:25 am

Andrew S wrote:
Thu Mar 25, 2021 5:31 am
Out of curiosity, does anybody know how most avid tea drinkers used small zhu ni pots during the Qing dynasty?

Those pots now seem to be ideal for brewing yan cha to me, stuffed with leaves and brewed until they run out of essence (or old liu an...), but I'd be grateful to learn how they were in fact used back then.

Andrew
Same. Yancha stuffed to the brim.
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