Adagio overtakes Steepster ?

User avatar
aet
Posts: 213
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:56 pm
Location: Kunming ( China )

Sun Jul 12, 2020 12:42 am

I'm lazy and have no time to do that , but would be interesting to take a screenshots and save links to bad reviews of their teas. See how long they will hold in same position ( not being deleted ) after the website is under their control.
Just an idea.
User avatar
debunix
Posts: 1133
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:27 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Sun Jul 12, 2020 8:36 pm

All these posts prompted me to download all of my tea reviews in case the site vanishes or vanishes my posts.
User avatar
Bok
Vendor
Posts: 3727
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:55 am
Location: Taiwan

Sun Jul 12, 2020 9:51 pm

The way they are replying and not assuming any responsibilities over past actions, doesn't bode well for Steepster's future...
polezaivsani
Posts: 85
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2019 4:43 pm
Location: Kaliningrad, RU

Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:03 am

aet wrote:
Sat Jul 11, 2020 2:58 pm
... I believe no problem to find 2 trustworthy people for free in such a club
Since the topic of ethics is brought up, may i ask why do you find it ok for somebody to work for free on your business? I'd expect that to be a usual practice in community projects like this here, but not in a business setting.
User avatar
aet
Posts: 213
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:56 pm
Location: Kunming ( China )

Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:58 am

polezaivsani wrote:
Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:03 am
aet wrote:
Sat Jul 11, 2020 2:58 pm
... I believe no problem to find 2 trustworthy people for free in such a club
Since the topic of ethics is brought up, may i ask why do you find it ok for somebody to work for free on your business? I'd expect that to be a usual practice in community projects like this here, but not in a business setting.
I was referring to subject of original owners running that community project on their costs which was, at least in my understanding , brought up as one of the factors why they gave up Steepster. Not only because they don't have time for this.
What I'm trying to say here is , that actual costs of running such a great website / community is less than 100$/ year , because it has enthusiasts who are willing to help without seeking any reward ( currently they have been doing so for a long time , as far as I know ).
So you don't even need too much time for this which is also opposing to the second claim ( no time ) .

In fact, if they really wanted , they could easily get founded from either supporters ( like each of us would pay 1$ per year, or something ;-) or just place some google add banner ( 1 small delicate is enough ) and site is financially self sustained or even generate some small money for admins reward for example. I've read before some people even offered to collect money for anti spam login module with captcha for few $ , just to keep the forum running without Viagra offers..etc.

But what they did instead , and I support them in this, waited when somebody comes with some interesting offer and sold it.
Fair play to them for sure.
polezaivsani
Posts: 85
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2019 4:43 pm
Location: Kaliningrad, RU

Mon Jul 13, 2020 7:01 am

I'm really sorry, @aet, i misunderstood your comment initially.

I missed out on the better days of teachat and steepster but, given a chance - this community right here is something i love more that tea ware (which is a big thing for me) - positive and welcoming international concoction!
User avatar
aet
Posts: 213
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:56 pm
Location: Kunming ( China )

Mon Jul 13, 2020 8:11 am

polezaivsani wrote:
Mon Jul 13, 2020 7:01 am
I'm really sorry, aet, i misunderstood your comment initially.

I missed out on the better days of teachat and steepster but, given a chance - this community right here is something i love more that tea ware (which is a big thing for me) - positive and welcoming international concoction!
no worries. Be honest, I don't really think that any community can be more active than the one on FB, because it's an app which many people have on the phone and handy along with other groups of their interest and friends ( within the FB app ) .
I think this forum is the only decent replacement for Tchat and Steepster altogether.
User avatar
Chip
Admin
Posts: 362
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:47 pm
Location: In the TeaCave atop Mt Fuji
Contact:

Mon Jul 13, 2020 4:03 pm

Ok, here goes ...

As a general rule, I rarely discuss in detail what occurred on TeaChat in 2017. Partly to not bore peeps but also so I do not have to relive it over and over.

However, the Steepster topic has fundamental "facts" that are blatantly NOT TRUE. I therefore feel compelled to share here.

Please pardon the length of the following post, I truly attempted to be as concise as possible w/o losing too much substance.
User avatar
Chip
Admin
Posts: 362
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:47 pm
Location: In the TeaCave atop Mt Fuji
Contact:

Mon Jul 13, 2020 4:16 pm

I have decided to post this information here for the record. Although I have no plans to post this on Steepster, if someone wants to copy and quote me there, please feel free to do so!

I have thought how to respond, and I have concluded this is the path I will take. Sadly for me, this brings the experience back to the surface.

I will always cherish the time I was mod/admin of TeaChat for going on 12 years, duly nominated and elected by the members of TeaChat! I truly put my heart and soul into the forum. Never in my wildest dreams did I think it would all come crashing down at the hands of Adagio

All it took was a brief period of time. Very brief. This should serve as a warning.

However, to this day I wish the forum and Adadio the very best.

Likewise, I truly hope Steepster ... figures things out and has a bright future. However, there is a cloud hanging over it.

I will do my best here and as concisely as possible to set the record straight from my experiences in 2017 ... as incredibly Tea Forum, TeaChat, and Steepster have suddenly converged with each other.

Having read the Steepster topic, I will address two primary issues where there are "facts" being posted that are simply NOT TRUE.



1. Entire Category, Topic, Post deletions by Adagio.

I became suddenly aware that en masse posts had been removed from TeaChat. I first noticed this when my post total dropped by more than 1600. Sometimes, it is hard to see what is no longer present.

But after some checking and with the assistance of other members, it became clear that the entire category OTTI (official tea tasting initiative) category was gone. I want to stress, this was an entire PRODUCT REVIEW category that was suddenly purged from TeaChat w/o warning nor input.

This was heart breaking. Countless hours of planning, working with vendors, tastings, reviews, and postings had been removed from TeaChat.

These tastings also had a cost factor borne by yours truly and members.

These were not "members only" areas as mentioned by Michael on Steepster.

These were all public posts.

These were posts that members had taken the time and energy to post.

These were posts of member conducted tastings and their thoughtful reviews ... the very types of posts claimed to have NOT been deleted by Michael!!!

Hard to say what else was deleted at that time, but my restricted admin "work area" was intact. As was an area referred to as ITD (intense tea discussion) that was also restricted. So, I have no idea what Michael is referring to as "members only." There were no other restricted access areas on TeaChat!

2. My termination as admin/mod of TeaChat after 11+ years. NO, I did NOT resign as Michael stated on Steepster!

If you were around at this time, you likely witnessed that I fought tooth and nail to the bitter end for the integrity, preservation, and permanence of ALL POSTS on TeaChat. Never did I ever once think that our up to then wonderful host Adagio would remove posts en masse! And w/o warning nor discussion, but this is what occurred ... period.

I fought for the return of the literally 1000s of posts. Members understandably clamoured for the return of members' posts AND an explanation.

I automatically became the advocate for these members. "Steve's" responses were condescending and dismissive. He offered no resolution and resorted to name calling instead.

He then continued to remove entire topics related to this ... outrage. Most of these topics or portions thereof were fortunately preemptively preserved by members via screenshots of which I have some as well.

Ultimately, he abruptly and w/o warning de facto fired me, the MEMBER elected moderator/admin. He removed all my forum mod/admin permissions. Poof! No warning, no direct contact ...

But it got even better ... that was apparently not enough. He then posted a humiliating and embarrassing post about my dismissal ... and locked the topic! How nice ...

At this point I went to Michael, not to beg for reinstatement, but to ask for the removal of the humiliating and embarrassing post about my dismissal. I had to beg for its removal.

But not before I took a screenshot.

Keep in mind, Adagio had "empowered" (what Michael told me) Steve, an Adagio employee to do ... whatever ... on TeaChat!
User avatar
Chip
Admin
Posts: 362
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:47 pm
Location: In the TeaCave atop Mt Fuji
Contact:

Mon Jul 13, 2020 4:29 pm

Oh, be aware and beware of "terms of use." Nobody remembers seeing this on TeaChat, so I suspect it was added later.

Terms of use such as on TeaChat and likely to be added to Steepster gives Adagio carte blanche to pretty much do anything they want to do on their forum(s) including ... wait for it ... deleting member posts.

So, I have to ask myself, has Adagio learned anything when it comes to forums and how to treat members with respect and honor posts???

Or are member posts still so easily discarded?

If Adagio is serious about not removing members' posts going forward, I would challenge them to begin by changing their terms of use to reflect this ... explicitly!
John_B
Posts: 128
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:42 am
Location: Bangkok
Contact:

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:59 am

I don't necessarily blame Adagio for botching Tea Chat. Every company has staff at every level coming and going, and some are going to be worse than others. They'll probably botch Steepster too, but let's wait and see.

Those comments about some perspective being un-American and illiberal weren't very promising. Or as others have mentioned here them not going even as far as saying "mistakes were made," related to the Tea Chat meltdown.
Last edited by Victoria on Thu Jul 16, 2020 2:25 am, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Mod edit: moved post & added topic title
User avatar
Bok
Vendor
Posts: 3727
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:55 am
Location: Taiwan

Thu Jul 16, 2020 6:24 am

Also deafening silence in regards to recent fake accounts for promotion and screenshots taken of later disappeared heated discussions...

He knew exactly what happened and has no reply which would not make him look worse than it already is.
User avatar
Dresden
Posts: 104
Joined: Sat Mar 30, 2019 11:31 pm
Location: Bayou Self, Louisiana

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:45 pm

Well said @Chip. I, for one was outraged when the OTTI came down. We as members spent our own money to purchase teas, post comparative reviews, and broaden our knowledge and appreciation for tea. Add to this monumental task that you took on coordinating participants, acquiring product, packing countless individual sample bags, etc, and it truly is a shame that this wealth of accumulated experience was obliterated.

Truth be told, OTTI was one of the main things keeping me going back to TC at the time in which all of this happened. When OTTI disappeared, I pretty much did too. I would occasionally pop back in on the live chat but not nearly as often. Hopefully they have learned from these past mistakes, but unfortunately I have my doubts.
User avatar
Chip
Admin
Posts: 362
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:47 pm
Location: In the TeaCave atop Mt Fuji
Contact:

Thu Jul 16, 2020 2:37 pm

Dresden wrote:
Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:45 pm
Well said Chip. I, for one was outraged when the OTTI came down. We as members spent our own money to purchase teas, post comparative reviews, and broaden our knowledge and appreciation for tea. Add to this monumental task that you took on coordinating participants, acquiring product, packing countless individual sample bags, etc, and it truly is a shame that this wealth of accumulated experience was obliterated.

Truth be told, OTTI was one of the main things keeping me going back to TC at the time in which all of this happened. When OTTI disappeared, I pretty much did too. I would occasionally pop back in on the live chat but not nearly as often. Hopefully they have learned from these past mistakes, but unfortunately I have my doubts.
It is very difficult to learn from mistakes that are being adamantly denied ... and labeling this type of information as "conspiracy theory" ... :roll:

Likewise, OTTI though incredibly time consuming to conduct, was also a most rewarding part of my TC experience!

How and why OTTI was singled out to be removed en masse is completely beyond my comprehension. I could argue that there were older, less relevant posts ... but why remove any?

In this day and age, there really is not a good reason to remove efforts by members simply because they can. A person can drive their car off a bridge, but they do not because it is crazy and deadly to do so. They essentially drove the car off the bridge ... several times ... because they could. In the process they essentially killed TC.

And now they deny it even happened ... so I do not believe ultimately they learned from their past mistakes.
User avatar
TeaTotaling
Posts: 380
Joined: Sat Apr 25, 2020 3:08 pm
Location: Ohio

Thu Jul 16, 2020 4:54 pm

Chip wrote:
Thu Jul 16, 2020 2:37 pm
Dresden wrote:
Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:45 pm
Well said Chip. I, for one was outraged when the OTTI came down. We as members spent our own money to purchase teas, post comparative reviews, and broaden our knowledge and appreciation for tea. Add to this monumental task that you took on coordinating participants, acquiring product, packing countless individual sample bags, etc, and it truly is a shame that this wealth of accumulated experience was obliterated.

Truth be told, OTTI was one of the main things keeping me going back to TC at the time in which all of this happened. When OTTI disappeared, I pretty much did too. I would occasionally pop back in on the live chat but not nearly as often. Hopefully they have learned from these past mistakes, but unfortunately I have my doubts.
It is very difficult to learn from mistakes that are being adamantly denied ... and labeling this type of information as "conspiracy theory" ... :roll:

Likewise, OTTI though incredibly time consuming to conduct, was also a most rewarding part of my TC experience!

How and why OTTI was singled out to be removed en masse is completely beyond my comprehension. I could argue that there were older, less relevant posts ... but why remove any?

In this day and age, there really is not a good reason to remove efforts by members simply because they can. A person can drive their car off a bridge, but they do not because it is crazy and deadly to do so. They essentially drove the car off the bridge ... several times ... because they could. In the process they essentially killed TC.

And now they deny it even happened ... so I do not believe ultimately they learned from their past mistakes.
And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

A couple months ago I joined TC before joining TF. It didn't take long for me notice something was off, it quite literally felt dead ☠️ You know a tree by it's fruits, and now I'm beginning to understand the big picture. Makes sense.

The labeling of alternative, factual information, that doesn't fit the narrative as "conspiracy theory" is pathetic. I have been noticing this dimwitted tactic for some time now across different platforms of information, and through real life experiences. Sad to see it rearing it's ugly head in the tea community. In the end truth always prevails.
Post Reply