copper kettles?

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wave_code
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:01 am

I've seen a few copper kettles around both new ones from vendors like Hojo as well as vintage kettles. Anyone here have any experience using copper kettles and if they have any noticeable effect? Or are they more just for show?

Some of the Japanese ones I have seen look quite nice, though I wouldn't use a vintage one for anything other than a watering can for plants for safety reasons. Some of the newer ones are quite appealing though, in particular the oxidized ones. They are a little more budget friendly than a lot of nice tetsubins being closer in price to clay kettles, and I imagine weight wise maybe a little easier to handle?
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Balthazar
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 4:26 am

Hojo has also written the following:
On the other hand, some materials that are commonly used could also weaken the after taste of anything that is cooked or boiled in it . For example: aluminum, brass and copper are the 3 major materials that could kill off after taste, sometimes they could even cause dryness on the tongue. I think that many people cannot accept this fact since copper and aluminum are very common materials for cooking equipment. Sometimes, copper equipment can be more expensive than other material due to their efficiency in heat conduct.
I've tried boiling water in my grandma's old copper kettle at least one time, but can't remember how I found it (it's 6-7 years ago). Probably didn't love it, or I imagine I'd use the kettle more...
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Bok
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 6:34 am

I used an old tin lined flea market copper kettle a long time ago, I second Hojos assessments, it’s terrible for tea.
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wave_code
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:17 am

I had my suspicions they wouldn't be particularly good. after all, when tap water tastes bad its usually the first thing people say- it tastes like copper or pipes. Odd to think it performs so poorly for tea, and to then sell fancy copper kettles :roll:
faj
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:38 am

wave_code wrote:
Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:17 am
Odd to think it performs so poorly for tea, and to then sell fancy copper kettles :roll:
If, to some people, the main intended function of a kettle is to say on a shelf and look fancy, then it is not that odd. Then again, I guess tastes vary, and not everyone is that picky about the taste of tea to begin with : maybe to the buyers the taste of water from these kettles is good, or not important.
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Bok
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:50 am

faj wrote:
Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:38 am
maybe to the buyers the taste of water from these kettles is good, or not important.
I think that is probably the case for some, your average English breakfast won't taste much worse in it anyways :lol:
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Balthazar
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:56 am

Copper also transfers heat much faster than stainless steel, so a copper kettle could save a significant amount of time (and reduce your energy consumption). I don't think that's a deal breaker for anyone on this forum, but it could be for some "kettle normies" out there :)
.m.
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:05 am

Hojo makes a lot strange claims. In this instance he says that tin is great (https://hojotea.com/item_e/tsuiki-doki.htm):
"With this copper teapot, the internal tin liner which made of 99.99% of tin significantly improves the intensity of flavor and the depth of after taste. It gives a very clean taste with smooth and “silky” mouthfeel. After you have drunk the tea, it does not leave your mouth feeling dry or astringent; instead it gives a lingering after taste that is complex and evolving."
He also say that platinum and gold improve taste (https://hojotea.com/en/posts-42/): It might be possible since they both can act as catalyst, but who knows... However, his argument against aluminium:
"Beer cans are usually made from aluminum. Due to the effect of aluminum, the taste of beer becomes flatter. If we try the same beer packaged in glass bottle, the taste is obviously different and better compared to canned beer"
can hardly be taken seriously since beer cans are lined with a thin layer of epoxy (not to mention that some beer enthusiasts swear by cans for protecting better aroma in IPA style beers).
The fact is, aluminium, brass and copper are commonly used by villagers and village teahouses in china. Is it because they don't know better?
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Bok
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:06 am

Balthazar wrote:
Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:56 am
Copper also transfers heat much faster than stainless steel, so a copper kettle could save a significant amount of time (and reduce your energy consumption). I don't think that's a deal breaker for anyone on this forum, but it could be for some "kettle normies" out there :)
Good point! Also a lot of the water is also probably used for other uses than to make tea. For coffee I'd imagine it to matter a lot less.
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StoneLadle
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:41 am

Copper stored water for drinking, yes... In India, Burma, Cambodia, less sanitary parts of Indonesia.. yes yes yes...

For tea as we know it now...

For cooking milk tea or Chai Indian style, yes...

For cooking coffee Turkish or Greek style I've seen and tasted , very smooth and creamy without milk....

For tea as we know it...

No
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wave_code
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Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:52 am

.m. wrote:
Fri Sep 11, 2020 9:05 am
However, his argument against aluminium:
"Beer cans are usually made from aluminum. Due to the effect of aluminum, the taste of beer becomes flatter. If we try the same beer packaged in glass bottle, the taste is obviously different and better compared to canned beer"
can hardly be taken seriously since beer cans are lined with a thin layer of epoxy (not to mention that some beer enthusiasts swear by cans for protecting better aroma in IPA style beers).
The fact is, aluminium, brass and copper are commonly used by villagers and village teahouses in china. Is it because they don't know better?
yeah I think nobody here will dispute that Hojo is prone to some odd claims. it sounds like in this case too he is conflating the entire process with the outer material. as you point out there isn't really contact between the beer and the aluminum.

I was talking with my friend about canning when I was visiting his brewery last summer. He was saying how he has nothing against cans and that he doesn't think canning in and of itself is bad, but rather that a lot of people who do the canning don't do a very good job. For a lot of small breweries they don't have a canning line, but rather use a mobile service where you print labels and they show up, can your beer with machines on a truck, stick on your label, and you are done. He actually had wanted to move into cans because its cheaper and easier than glass as a way to expand distribution and keeping up with the steady flow of kegs and cleaning is enough work on its own. What he was waiting for was someone who he felt offered enough quality control to meet his standards because everyone he had tried working with so far he felt had degraded the quality of the beer significantly enough that he didn't want to send it out with the brewery's name on it. I guess it shows how it is not all just material but also the process quality that comes with that material makes a big difference.
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