Ode to the Kyusu

twno1
Posts: 52
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2020 2:48 am
Location: California & Taiwan

Thu May 21, 2020 10:27 pm

Bok wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 10:12 pm
twno1 I might be wrong, but isn't Japanese tea in general meant to be poured very slowly anyways? Fast pour is useful for Oolong in my experience.
I'm still new to the whole tea world but Hojo says shiboridashi should have fast flow. I'm assuming the one in the video is a 110ml shiboridashi from his website and he pours the whole thing in ~5 seconds, which is about twice the speed I'm getting...
User avatar
Bok
Vendor
Posts: 3171
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2017 8:55 am
Location: Taiwan

Thu May 21, 2020 10:32 pm

twno1 wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 10:27 pm
Bok wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 10:12 pm
twno1 I might be wrong, but isn't Japanese tea in general meant to be poured very slowly anyways? Fast pour is useful for Oolong in my experience.
I'm still new to the whole tea world but Hojo says shiboridashi should have fast flow. I'm assuming the one in the video is a 110ml shiboridashi from his website and he pours the whole thing in ~5 seconds, which is about twice the speed I'm getting...
Then it is probably a case of not-ideal design... you can always speed up the pour by lifting the lid with one finger while pouring, but it kind of defeats the purpose of the item.
User avatar
Victoria
Admin
Posts: 2069
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2017 3:33 pm
Location: Santa Monica, CA
Contact:

Thu May 21, 2020 10:49 pm

Bok wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 10:32 pm
twno1 wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 10:27 pm
Bok wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 10:12 pm
twno1 I might be wrong, but isn't Japanese tea in general meant to be poured very slowly anyways? Fast pour is useful for Oolong in my experience.
I'm still new to the whole tea world but Hojo says shiboridashi should have fast flow. I'm assuming the one in the video is a 110ml shiboridashi from his website and he pours the whole thing in ~5 seconds, which is about twice the speed I'm getting...
Then it is probably a case of not-ideal design... you can always speed up the pour by lifting the lid with one finger while pouring, but it kind of defeats the purpose of the item.
I have a few very fast pouring kyusu, mainly that have large sesame filters, they are truly enjoyable to use leaving no liquid behind. Most though, pour a more ‘normal speed‘ for Japanese kyusu, definitely slower that Chinese single hole teapots. Most Japanese greens, being steeped at lower temperatures, can handle a slow steady pour, allowing the very fine leaves to remain at the bottom of the kyusu, and not clog the wall filter. Ball filters are in between sesame and wall filter, and are less prone to getting clogged up by small leaves, they also pour slightly faster than wall filters. Typically I’ll do a slow pour, unless it’s a sesame filter that I use for Fukamushi. But now I see you are referring to filterless Shiboridashi, I have two and neither are fast, if pouring too fast the small Gyokuro leaves will block the rake indents blocking the liquor from coming out. I enjoy reading Hojo’s posts, they are unique and idiosyncratic.
User avatar
Baisao
Posts: 668
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 5:17 pm
Location: Austin, TX

Fri May 22, 2020 12:15 am

Bok wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 10:12 pm
twno1 I might be wrong, but isn't Japanese tea in general meant to be poured very slowly anyways? Fast pour is useful for Oolong in my experience.
Yes. Slowly, otherwise you’ll clog the filter. Wet sencha and gyokuro leaves are thin and can clog the filter easily. With a kyusu, tip so that the tea is just pouring through the bottom of the filter.

No need to hurry with the shiboridashi either.
User avatar
Tor
Posts: 83
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 6:19 am
Location: Bangkok

Fri May 22, 2020 12:21 am

twno1 wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 10:27 pm

I'm still new to the whole tea world but Hojo says shiboridashi should have fast flow. I'm assuming the one in the video is a 110ml shiboridashi from his website and he pours the whole thing in ~5 seconds, which is about twice the speed I'm getting...
You can tilt the lid back to make a wider opening just like you do with a gaiwan. The trade-off is that there’ll be more leaves coming out.
faj
Posts: 291
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2019 6:45 am
Location: Quebec

Fri May 22, 2020 6:17 am

twno1 wrote:
Thu May 21, 2020 9:54 pm
Should a shiboridashi have a fast or slow pour speed? I recently got two and they pour extremely slowly compared to side handled kyusu.
The one I use is the flatter type often used for gyokuro, good for maybe 50ml. There is no lip for the lid to sit on, and the shape of the lid and bowl are such that you can alter the angle of the lid which slightly alters how big the opening is. You question caused be to wonder how quick the pour is on it.

I made a quick test this morning, and with the lid horizontal it is about 5s, while giving it an angle at the limit of what I would expect to be usable, I get 2s. Extrapolating the same flow to the size of yours gives similar results.

Personally, I find it a joy to use. The pour may seem slow, but given the small volume it is not that important. Though the concept itself may seem a bit rudimentary (i.e. vs. a filter), it is actually very good at keeping the leaves inside, and while not very fast pouring, it also does not clog and is good at getting as much of the liquid out as possible. I also find that teapot to feel very good in the hand holding it between my thumb and fingers. And cleaning is a breeze.
User avatar
debunix
Posts: 930
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:27 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Fri May 22, 2020 10:58 am

faj wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 6:17 am
There is no lip for the lid to sit on, and the shape of the lid and bowl are such that you can alter the angle of the lid which slightly alters how big the opening is.
Sounds functionally like a gaiwan, but flatter and with a spout.
faj
Posts: 291
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2019 6:45 am
Location: Quebec

Fri May 22, 2020 11:15 am

debunix wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 10:58 am
faj wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 6:17 am
There is no lip for the lid to sit on, and the shape of the lid and bowl are such that you can alter the angle of the lid which slightly alters how big the opening is.
Sounds functionally like a gaiwan, but flatter and with a spout.
I never thought of that, but now that you mention it there is an obvious similarity. However, because the bowl is shallow, the angle of the surface on which the lid rests is different, I find it easier to make small adjustments to the flow than with a gaiwan, though to be honest I never need to adjust the flow with that shiboridashi : it is designed just right for its intended use.

I only have one gaiwan, so my experience is limited, but I find it prone to going from "no flow" to "too much opening" (not an issue obviously with most Chinese teas) with a small adjustment. My gaiwan is not usable for tea with fine leaves, while the shiboridashi is. I think I will try it with fukamushi, just as a test.

My shiboridashi has small grooves in front of the spout. They are very shallow and narrow, I am not sure if they play a role other than cosmetic.
User avatar
debunix
Posts: 930
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:27 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Fri May 22, 2020 11:36 am

faj wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 11:15 am
I never need to adjust the flow with that shiboridashi : it is designed just right for its intended use.
Sounds lovely.
faj wrote:
Fri May 22, 2020 11:15 am
I only have one gaiwan, so my experience is limited, but I find it prone to going from "no flow" to "too much opening" (not an issue obviously with most Chinese teas) with a small adjustment.
It definitely takes some practice, and when I get one of mine out and use it for a few days in a row, I get better at it again, but while I have used them for gyokuro and sencha on occasion, they're clearly not meant for that, and flow is slow through all the leaves.
Post Reply