Yixing

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Bok
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Mon May 03, 2021 6:38 am

Mark-S wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 6:35 am
Bok

Why are the letters on your pot so shiny? Is this another technique? They always look like this on my pots (sometimes more refined though):

(I know it's not the same pot, clay or quality)
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Should be the play of light and shadows, my pot looks pretty much the same as yours. I’ll take some later with different light.
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Mon May 03, 2021 7:38 am

@Mark-S there you go:
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Mark-S
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Mon May 03, 2021 8:27 am

Thanks, @Bok!

Your characters are a bit thicker. But you are right, other than that, the teapots are pretty much the same. Even the clay seems to be the same or at least similar - nice.

What would you call this clay? I'd call this Zini, but I can't tell for sure if a clay is regular Zini, a special kind of Zini (Qing Shui Ni or Di Cao Qing, for example) or just Zisha. This topic is still pretty confusing to me. :lol:
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Youzi
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Mon May 03, 2021 8:33 am

Mark-S wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 8:27 am
Thanks, Bok!

Your characters are a bit thicker. But you are right, other than that, the teapots are pretty much the same. Even the clay seems to be the same or at least similar - nice.

What would you call this clay? I'd call this Zini, but I can't tell for sure if a clay is regular Zini, a special kind of Zini (Qing Shui Ni or Di Cao Qing, for example) or just Zisha. This topic is still pretty confusing to me. :lol:
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Just call it zisha, then you can never be wrong :D :D :D :D
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Mon May 03, 2021 8:36 am

Youzi wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 8:33 am
Mark-S wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 8:27 am
Thanks, Bok!

Your characters are a bit thicker. But you are right, other than that, the teapots are pretty much the same. Even the clay seems to be the same or at least similar - nice.

What would you call this clay? I'd call this Zini, but I can't tell for sure if a clay is regular Zini, a special kind of Zini (Qing Shui Ni or Di Cao Qing, for example) or just Zisha. This topic is still pretty confusing to me. :lol:
Image
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Just call it zisha, then you can never be wrong :D :D :D :D
Yes. That’s the best answer :mrgreen:

It’s just names. I just call this 70s Zisha 😜
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Mon May 03, 2021 8:40 am

@Youzi @Bok

All right, I like that. :lol:
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Mon May 03, 2021 8:41 am

In my view it doesn’t really matter that much what it’s called. The modern Yixing guys seem to have made it a sport to confuse people even more with unheard of and mythical names of clays.

It’s a bit like a curry, innit’ ? it’s yellow, red, green or brown. If it’s delicious, who cares about the details… > if it makes good tea that’s all that counts.
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Mon May 03, 2021 8:58 am

Mark-S wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 8:27 am
Thanks, Bok!

Your characters are a bit thicker. But you are right, other than that, the teapots are pretty much the same. Even the clay seems to be the same or at least similar - nice.

What would you call this clay? I'd call this Zini, but I can't tell for sure if a clay is regular Zini, a special kind of Zini (Qing Shui Ni or Di Cao Qing, for example) or just Zisha. This topic is still pretty confusing to me. :lol:
It's qingshuini, which is a kind of zini, which is a kind of zisha. It will behave quite similar to most other zini in terms of performance.
Mark-S
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Mon May 03, 2021 9:19 am

Bok wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 8:41 am
It’s a bit like a curry, innit’ ? it’s yellow, red, green or brown. If it’s delicious, who cares about the details… > if it makes good tea that’s all that counts.
Right :) I prefer the softer clays, like the clay of this pot. The surface is satin-like (photo below). But nonetheless, this 70's Zisha, qingshuini, whatsoever clay should make a nice cup of tea. It looks very natural.
Teas We Like wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 8:58 am
It's qingshuini, which is a kind of zini, which is a kind of zisha. It will behave quite similar to most other zini in terms of performance.
Thanks ;) do you have a Di Cao Qing pot of this period? So I can see what this clay should look like in comparison? Since most sellers use these terms it would be nice to know.
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Mon May 03, 2021 9:26 am

@Mark-S Dicaoqing is a modern clay, not used in the 70s as far as I am aware. I’ve handled antiques which are made of Zisha that would probably nowadays be called Dicaoqing but back then the term didn’t exist.

The clay of our pots is pretty good all around in my experience, brews many teas quite well.
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Mon May 03, 2021 9:42 am

Mark-S wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 9:19 am
Bok wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 8:41 am
It’s a bit like a curry, innit’ ? it’s yellow, red, green or brown. If it’s delicious, who cares about the details… > if it makes good tea that’s all that counts.
Right :) I prefer the softer clays, like the clay of this pot. The surface is satin-like (photo below). But nonetheless, this 70's Zisha, qingshuini, whatsoever clay should make a nice cup of tea. It looks very natural.
Teas We Like wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 8:58 am
It's qingshuini, which is a kind of zini, which is a kind of zisha. It will behave quite similar to most other zini in terms of performance.
Thanks ;) do you have a Di Cao Qing pot of this period? So I can see what this clay should look like in comparison? Since most sellers use these terms it would be nice to know.
Image
Di cao Qing is a specific zini ore. As far as I know f1 didn't care about using single ore types for their clays. (you have to carefully select it usually by hand.)

They preferred to pix ores to achieve a general look after firing.

But if this isn't true, then someone knowledgable, please correct me.
Mark-S
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Mon May 03, 2021 9:44 am

Bok wrote:
Mon May 03, 2021 9:26 am
Mark-S Dicaoqing is a modern clay, not used in the 70s as far as I am aware. I’ve handled antiques which are made of Zisha that would probably nowadays be called Dicaoqing but back then the term didn’t exist.

The clay of our pots is pretty good all around in my experience, brews many teas quite well.
I've read that Dicaoqing would be a rare type of Zini so I wanted to know what this clay actually looks like. ;) Many people claim that their pots would be made of this clay... but they all look different... so I guess most people simply don't know it. Or I'm missing something...

I got this information from this post:
Qing Shui Ni just means 'pure clay', Di Cao Qing kinda means 'clay from deep inside', there's no dictionary on clay term and meaning differs day by day, by today's standards,

Zi Ni - one of three majoy Yixing clay (along with red (Hongni) and yellow (Duanni), so it imples DCQ and QSN as well, but nowadays people tends to call darker clay that is not QSN or DCQ.

Qing Shui Ni - pure clay, color is lighter than other Zi ni, mostly mined from middle parts of ore, back then the amount was so many, so nicknamed 'Pu Ni' - normal clay.

Di Cao Qing - mined from deep inside, heavy and pure part of ore, color tends to be halfway between Qing Shui Ni and Zi Ni

Pin Zi Ni - mixed Zi Ni

Zi Sha - Yixing clay (as a whole)

once again, there's no dictionary on clay term, but people just tend to call by color these days I'm noticing, they are not so hard at calling them except for Di Cao Qing, because Di Cao Qing is rare clay.

While Qing Shui Ni tends to be simpler and cheaper, there are so many kinds of Zi Ni however,

like Zi Jia Ni, Tian Qing Ni, Qing Hui Ni, Te Pin Zi Ni, Tie Sha Ni, Hei Xing Ni,

and the term itself, history is not so long, most of them don't go more than factory-1 year (55~97), serious clay study just started since 80's. Before that, terms were created by clay manufacturers and miners and potters, not officially. Then with Factory-1 and heavy followers of Yixing collectors from Taiwan made em as nowadays.
http://teadrunk.org/topic/145/examples-of-clays/
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Mon May 03, 2021 9:58 am

@Mark-S

The ores were always there for millions of years in the ground. The difference is that previously they didn't care to select and categorize them. Or did, but used different names for them. Telling the exact ore a teapot is made of (assuming it isn't mixed, which it probably is) after firing is already a really challenging task due to ways firing effects the color and texture, then processing the grain size, surface texture, building techniques the the look & touch of the outside etc.

The reason it is relatively possible with F1 is because they were fairly consistent with their colors and look of their clay.

Just think of F1 like a modern studio, who only works with their own stuff. Like for example Mud and Leaves.

Their clays and colors are fairly consistent, so basically talking about clays, effects and textures with their pots is the same topic, type of discussion as with F1 teapots.

Which are also a single "studio" teapots and their clays.
Mark-S
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Wed May 05, 2021 4:58 am

@Youzi

I wonder if the more experienced potters had access to better clay in F1. Especially, during the cultural revolution it would make sense that every potter had access to the same raw material.

Btw.: It's nice to have people with so much knowledge in this forum (this applies to the other experts here as well ;) ). Thank you very much!

---

...glub...glub.... (I hope it's a fish... :lol: )
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Wed May 05, 2021 6:09 am

Cute dragon fish :)
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