Yixing

mafoofan
Posts: 67
Joined: Fri Mar 06, 2020 8:34 am

Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:53 pm

DailyTX wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:48 pm
mafoofan wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:00 pm
DailyTX wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 3:30 pm
Pictures don’t tell much in my opinion.
Really? Can’t confirm full vs. half handmade? Quality of workmanship? Quality of clay?
With modern pot, it’s hard to tell full vs. half handmade. By the pictures, it seems it’s not made by machine, and it’s not slipcast. Workmanship using modern pot judgement, look at the pot to see if the body, lid, and the top of the lid are proportionate, are the handle and sprout balanced, and a photo of the filter will tell more of interior craftsmanship.
Clay quality is so much more complicated. Based on the photos you posted, it looks like either mixed clay; however, color various due to firing temperature, clay type, and aging time. Not to make things more complicated, if you can get the seller/maker to tell you the clay type, then you can look at the property of the clay, does it have the minerals mentioned on yixing zisha text.
Thank you! What I was told:

1. Fully handmade.
2. 20+ year old zhini clay.
3. No interior seam line visible because the maker is expert at hiding it.

What I can tell in person:

1. Lid fit is tight.
2. Spout, brim, and handle are level.
3. No strange odors. No colors released when I boiled the pot.
4. Finish and detail look nicely executed—but I don’t have much basis for comparison.
DailyTX
Posts: 882
Joined: Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:43 pm
Location: United States

Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:02 pm

mafoofan wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:53 pm
DailyTX wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:48 pm
mafoofan wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:00 pm


Really? Can’t confirm full vs. half handmade? Quality of workmanship? Quality of clay?
With modern pot, it’s hard to tell full vs. half handmade. By the pictures, it seems it’s not made by machine, and it’s not slipcast. Workmanship using modern pot judgement, look at the pot to see if the body, lid, and the top of the lid are proportionate, are the handle and sprout balanced, and a photo of the filter will tell more of interior craftsmanship.
Clay quality is so much more complicated. Based on the photos you posted, it looks like either mixed clay; however, color various due to firing temperature, clay type, and aging time. Not to make things more complicated, if you can get the seller/maker to tell you the clay type, then you can look at the property of the clay, does it have the minerals mentioned on yixing zisha text.
Thank you! What I was told:

1. Fully handmade.
2. 20+ year old zhini clay.
3. No interior seam line visible because the maker is expert at hiding it.

What I can tell in person:

1. Lid fit is tight.
2. Spout, brim, and handle are level.
3. No strange odors. No colors released when I boiled the pot.
4. Finish and detail look nicely executed—but I don’t have much basis for comparison.
Maybe @Youzican comment about 20+ old zini.
The seam line was more appropriate to examine older pot, and this can be fake by a half handmade pot with an extra stripe of clay. The idea with modern pot is if it’s fully hand made, there should be very subtle difference on each side of the pot, the assumption is not possible to create pot 100% symmetrical.

Ask for info what you can tell in person, it reflects your satisfaction of the pot. Sounds like a keeper
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pantry
Posts: 389
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:34 am
Location: US East Coast

Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:12 pm

mafoofan wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:40 pm

Hmm. Should I think it odd nobody wants to offer an opinion?

Yes, I am the user—but I trust others are much more experienced.
Based on the images, the craftsmanship looks excellent. However, the ergonomics of the pot is part of the craftsmanship, and that's difficult to tell without seeing the pot in action. I have several pots by the same maker that I don't equally favor. Based on my own limited experience, the duo qiu shape you got should make excellent tea. The spout seems a bit skinny, so from your experience using the pot, how do you like it?
mafoofan
Posts: 67
Joined: Fri Mar 06, 2020 8:34 am

Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:31 pm

pantry wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:12 pm
mafoofan wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:40 pm

Hmm. Should I think it odd nobody wants to offer an opinion?

Yes, I am the user—but I trust others are much more experienced.
Based on the images, the craftsmanship looks excellent. However, the ergonomics of the pot is part of the craftsmanship, and that's difficult to tell without seeing the pot in action. I have several pots by the same maker that I don't equally favor. Based on my own limited experience, the duo qiu shape you got should make excellent tea. The spout seems a bit skinny, so from your experience using the pot, how do you like it?
The spout is indeed skinny. Pour is smooth and regular, but not particularly fast. Opposite of the cannon of a xi shi I used to have.
DailyTX
Posts: 882
Joined: Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:43 pm
Location: United States

Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:45 pm

pantry wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:12 pm
mafoofan wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:40 pm

Hmm. Should I think it odd nobody wants to offer an opinion?

Yes, I am the user—but I trust others are much more experienced.
Based on the images, the craftsmanship looks excellent. However, the ergonomics of the pot is part of the craftsmanship, and that's difficult to tell without seeing the pot in action. I have several pots by the same maker that I don't equally favor. Based on my own limited experience, the duo qiu shape you got should make excellent tea. The spout seems a bit skinny, so from your experience using the pot, how do you like it?
Sounds like a popular potter, mind sharing where you two got your pots from?
mafoofan
Posts: 67
Joined: Fri Mar 06, 2020 8:34 am

Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:50 pm

DailyTX wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:45 pm
Sounds like a popular potter, mind sharing where you two got your pots from?
The maker is Chen Ju Fang, wife of Master Zhou, from Wuxing Shan Fang studio. I am 100% confident in the provenance.

However, it is hard for me to confirm certain qualities on my own. For example, it is supposed to be fully handmade. While I have no reason to doubt so, I also don’t see any of the affirmative signs that others talk about. If no on one sees evidence that it was only half handmade, I will trust in the overall, apparent workmanship and reputation of the maker and dealer.

Also, the zhini clay is supposed to be the absolute top grade available from Master Zhou. One pays a big premium for it (multiples versus the basic stuff). However, I won’t know if there is any qualitative benefit for a while, as the pot is still essentially brand new.
DailyTX
Posts: 882
Joined: Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:43 pm
Location: United States

Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:01 pm

mafoofan wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:50 pm
DailyTX wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:45 pm
Sounds like a popular potter, mind sharing where you two got your pots from?
The maker is Chen Ju Fang, wife of Master Zhou, from Wuxing Shan Fang studio. I am 100% confident in the provenance.

However, it is hard for me to confirm certain qualities on my own. For example, it is supposed to be fully handmade. While I have no reason to doubt so, I also don’t see any of the affirmative signs that others talk about. If no on one sees evidence that it was only half handmade, I will trust in the overall, apparent workmanship and reputation of the maker and dealer.

Also, the zhini clay is supposed to be the absolute top grade available from Master Zhou. One pays a big premium for it (multiples versus the basic stuff). However, I won’t know if there is any qualitative benefit for a while, as the pot is still essentially brand new.
Yup, it is a quite famous studio in the west. If you ordered directly from them, they have enough credibility. As for clay, there is a saying in Chinese, “if you understand zini and it’s categories, you have figured out half of yixing.” Roughly translated. Basically there are too many subcategories for zini.
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pantry
Posts: 389
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Location: US East Coast

Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:10 pm

DailyTX wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:45 pm
Sounds like a popular potter, mind sharing where you two got your pots from?
Global tea hut and chanting pines sell them. This maker became popular I think partly due to the amazing marketing skills of GTH :lol: . Craftsmanship and clay quality are great--I'm happy with most of my pots. Some I like less because it doesn't pour as well as I like, but I think it's a subjective preference. I also love the half-handmade pot made by their apprentice. My knowledge and experience are quite limited, so take what I say with a grain of salt ;)
mafoofan
Posts: 67
Joined: Fri Mar 06, 2020 8:34 am

Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:16 pm

pantry wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:10 pm
Global tea hut and chanting pines sell them. This maker became popular I think partly due to the amazing marketing skills of GTH :lol: . Craftsmanship and clay quality are great--I'm happy with most of my pots. Some I like less because it doesn't pour as well as I like, but I think it's a subjective preference. I also love the half-handmade pot made by their apprentice. My knowledge and experience are quite limited, so take what I say with a grain of salt ;)
How can you tell if apprentice-made or made by Chen Ju Fang herself?
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pantry
Posts: 389
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Location: US East Coast

Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:21 pm

mafoofan wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:16 pm
pantry wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:10 pm
Global tea hut and chanting pines sell them. This maker became popular I think partly due to the amazing marketing skills of GTH :lol: . Craftsmanship and clay quality are great--I'm happy with most of my pots. Some I like less because it doesn't pour as well as I like, but I think it's a subjective preference. I also love the half-handmade pot made by their apprentice. My knowledge and experience are quite limited, so take what I say with a grain of salt ;)
How can you tell if apprentice-made or made by Chen Ju Fang herself?
According to the seller. I specifically bought one that's said by the apprentice. Of course, the one by CJF could very well have been made by apprentices too, but I'm not going to be stressed about that :)
DailyTX
Posts: 882
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Location: United States

Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:38 pm

pantry wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:21 pm
mafoofan wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:16 pm
pantry wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:10 pm
Global tea hut and chanting pines sell them. This maker became popular I think partly due to the amazing marketing skills of GTH :lol: . Craftsmanship and clay quality are great--I'm happy with most of my pots. Some I like less because it doesn't pour as well as I like, but I think it's a subjective preference. I also love the half-handmade pot made by their apprentice. My knowledge and experience are quite limited, so take what I say with a grain of salt ;)
How can you tell if apprentice-made or made by Chen Ju Fang herself?
According to the seller. I specifically bought one that's said by the apprentice. Of course, the one by CJF could very well have been made by apprentices too, but I'm not going to be stressed about that :)
+1 on this strategy
At the end of the day, it’s a pot that brew tea, as long as it serves it’s designed function, I am happy haha
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pantry
Posts: 389
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Location: US East Coast

Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:45 pm

My free pot!
Parents got this as a gift, but it’s too small for them (200ml).

The carving is not very smooth like it was done on a hard surface. But shouldn’t the clay be malleable before firing? Could someone please educate me what that might imply about the clay?
Last edited by pantry on Thu Apr 16, 2020 2:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
DailyTX
Posts: 882
Joined: Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:43 pm
Location: United States

Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:51 pm

pantry wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:45 pm
My free pot!
Parents got this as a gift, but it’s too small for them (200ml).

The carving is not very smooth like it was done on a hard surface. But shouldn’t the clay be malleable before firing? Could someone please educate me what that might imply about the clay?
Image
Image
Image
Pots can add craving after firing. As you can imagine, cutting into a piece of dough vs. cutting into a piece of bread. Adding craving after firing requires much more knife skills
DailyTX
Posts: 882
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Location: United States

Thu Mar 19, 2020 7:01 pm

Here is a video about carving on zisha
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pantry
Posts: 389
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:34 am
Location: US East Coast

Thu Mar 19, 2020 7:12 pm

DailyTX wrote:
Thu Mar 19, 2020 7:01 pm
Here is a video about carving on zisha
Thanks! Wow, the kid broke a pot so casually just like that :lol:
I gotta say I like my hex pot but got a little disappointed by the handwriting (carving). I suppose you can't expect all potters to also excel at calligraphy :😂:

By the way, just notice you're based in N. Cal (always assumed Texas because of your username). How are you coping with the shelter in place? I've been drinking tea non-stop
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