Yixing

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Youzi
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Location: Shaxi, Yunnan, China
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Wed Apr 15, 2020 3:50 pm

Mark-S wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 3:12 pm
Youzi @.m.

Thanks, in the past, I always poured hot water / tea over the teapot because it looks cool ( :mrgreen: ) and nearly everyone is doing this. But it's very hard to clean the decorations from stains. Good to know, that this is not necessary for the patina to develop. I never thought of pouring hot water over the pot before brewing, but it makes sense, and I will try this with my simpler teapots. Maybe, I can even try this with my decorated teapots since I use filtered water to make tea... The stains could be from the tea.
Usually you only need to keep pouring tea and hot water over your pot if it cannot develop a natural patina, which is a fault of the processing of the ore, and / or the firing.
The only time I pour hot water on the pot, if the tea spilled when I put the lid on, so that it removes tea stain from the outside of the pot.
Mark-S
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Wed Apr 15, 2020 7:18 pm

@Youzi
At what point do you know that a teapot won't develop a natural patina? How many sessions would this take (approximately)? 50? 100? ...?
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Bok
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Wed Apr 15, 2020 8:12 pm

I’m with Marshal and others on this. No pouring of water on the outside I only do once to preheat the pot. And another time when rinsing the pot with clear hot water.

Patina comes by itself.
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Bok
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Wed Apr 15, 2020 8:14 pm

Mark-S wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 7:18 pm
Youzi
At what point do you know that a teapot won't develop a natural patina? How many sessions would this take (approximately)? 50? 100? ...?
At 50 you should definitely see something happening.
karma
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Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:19 pm

How is a patina like this even possible? Is this even patina?

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OCTO
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Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:23 pm

Mark-S wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:19 am
Do you pour tea or water over your teapot? Some people say that this must be done to maintain the heat. But I also read somewhere that this would be nonsense. What about the patina? Would a teapot develop a patina even if you do not pour tea over it?
It's a tricky question with a very simple answer. We can choose to do both, and we can choose not to do both. Here comes the lengthy explanation....

A lot depends, again, on your own personal preference. I am on Marshall's camp when it comes to dirty mineral / tea stains that plagues a teapot. It renders a pot totally unpleasing aesthetically. I also have a tea master friend who looks past all these stains. His pot is covered with tea and mineral stains but it doesn't bother him a single bit. To him, it's a sign of a well used and seasoned pot. I have another collector friend who brushes tea over his teapots to encourage the patina to develop faster but yet have got no mineral or water stains on his pots. He polishes his pot every time after use. One man's meat, another's poison.

Fundamentally it's a choice between two brewing methods. Wet or Dry. It's really a simple choice. I do not take temperature retention as a real reason because weather temperatures differ depending on location. When brewing under 3ºC, your pot might lose heat very fast.... where as when I'm brewing... it's often 25ºC in an air-conditioned room. Therefore, the reason of pouring hot water / tea over the pot doesn't really contribute to heat retention at all. Hence, such an approach taken to a broader global audience might be misinterpreted. So let's keep is simple, Wet or Dry brewing methods. Both entails different results to a trained tongue. Aesthetically, patina will still develop on a well used pot, be it by Wet or Dry brewing method.

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Personally, I do both. A lot depends on my mood and my setup at that point of time. I rotate my tea trays and brewing apparatus every now and then. By doing so, I've learnt to be flexible to accept and optimise both brewing methods to my liking. I personally like a well and evenly developed patina. The Dry Method often leaves the lid a little under developed in the patina department but reduces the possibility of stains. The Wet Method often leaves corners and edges over developed in mineral / tea stains if the water source is highly laden with minerals. I often use large pots (300cc and above) and seldom brew my tea at full capacity. Hence, my teapot lid often have an under developed patina and I usually soak my spent teas overnight with the water at 100% capacity with the lid turned upside-down.

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There you go.... Wet Method brewing with a Dry Method approach at the end.... So it is wet or dry? I'd rather spend time enjoying my tea rather than figuring it out.... hahahahahaha..... Now back to my end in mind... a well developed and even patina.... As long as I am doing something to inch closer to my end in mind... that justifies the means... :D :D I also use my pots as "fairness cup" to keep my tea warm and for easy distribution. When doing so, I often run my tea down the lid (make sure it's dust free) while pouring tea. This will help balance the patina development on the lid.

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Bok
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Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:34 pm

@OCTO nothing to add to that! Very complete.
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Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:35 pm

karma wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:19 pm
How is a patina like this even possible? Is this even patina?

This clay looks very strange and also not like Yaobian at all...
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Balthazar
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Thu Apr 16, 2020 1:26 am

OCTO wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:23 pm
A lot depends, again, on your own personal preference. I am on Marshall's camp when it comes to dirty mineral / tea stains that plagues a teapot. It renders a pot totally unpleasing aesthetically. I also have a tea master friend who looks past all these stains. His pot is covered with tea and mineral stains but it doesn't bother him a single bit. To him, it's a sign of a well used and seasoned pot. I have another collector friend who brushes tea over his teapots to encourage the patina to develop faster but yet have got no mineral or water stains on his pots. He polishes his pot every time after use. One man's meat, another's poison.
Excellent post, @OCTO.

I should mention that while I agree with MarshalN on the general principles of "pot raising", I don't always practice what I preach. My favorite pot is in the "plagued by stains" category, the main reason being that I have a tendency to fill it almost all the way to the top with water, and not spread/clean up the tea that's pushed out when I put on the lid.

It is one ugly shuiping, but it brews great tea, and I am sufficiently adept at fooling myself that the ugliness is indeed a kind of beauty rather than a reflection of its owner's laziness :)
Last edited by Balthazar on Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Tor
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Thu Apr 16, 2020 3:52 am

Re. pouring hot water over the pot, it shouldn’t be that complicated. Just brew the tea 4 different ways; no pouring, pouring after, pouring before, and pouring both before and after. If you don’t notice any difference, just don’t do it. But if you see the differences, choose the type of pouring according to the effect you aim for.

I give the taste and character of the tea my first priority, so I don’t mind any cosmetic outcome of the brewing method.
mafoofan
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Thu Apr 16, 2020 4:53 am

I ask one question about whether well-made lids should be perfectly level and get chastised for being too picky—in a world where folks happily debate the aesthetic merits of pouring and brushing water over pots to achieve an even patina. :)

Regarding pouring over teapots to warm them: isn’t this a no-brainer if the teapot has cooled off between steeps? Say ~10 minutes have passed since the last infusion. The teapot is maybe slightly warm, but not much more than room temperature. I pour boiling water over it in this case, before proceeding to fill the pot again. There’s no question it heats up the pot. You can tell by touch.
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Tor
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Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:20 am

mafoofan wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 4:53 am
I ask one question about whether well-made lids should be perfectly level and get told I’m being too picky—in a world where folks happily debate the aesthetic merits of pouring and brushing water over pots to achieve an even patina. :)
Since the only rule that a full hand made pot must follow is that it’s made without using any mould or block, so any irregularities is possible (within reason). It’s up to each potter to determine what is acceptable. If you’re not satisfied with the piece you get, you should have the right to return it, especially for the high price items. What they’re trying to say is that unleveled lid wall is not uncommon for many full hand made teapots.
Mark-S
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Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:02 am

@OCTO
Thanks for this comprehensive answer. And I really like your pots. I thought I would be the only one who often uses larger pots. :)
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OCTO
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Thu Apr 16, 2020 6:51 am

Balthazar wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 1:26 am
OCTO wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 11:23 pm
A lot depends, again, on your own personal preference. I am on Marshall's camp when it comes to dirty mineral / tea stains that plagues a teapot. It renders a pot totally unpleasing aesthetically. I also have a tea master friend who looks past all these stains. His pot is covered with tea and mineral stains but it doesn't bother him a single bit. To him, it's a sign of a well used and seasoned pot. I have another collector friend who brushes tea over his teapots to encourage the patina to develop faster but yet have got no mineral or water stains on his pots. He polishes his pot every time after use. One man's meat, another's poison.
Excellent post, OCTO.

I should mention that while I agree with MarshalN on the general principles of "pot raising", I don't always practice what I preach. My favorite pot is in the "plagued by stains" category, the main reason being that I have a tendency to fill it almost all the way to the top with water, and not spread/clean up the tea that's pushed out when I put on the lid.

It is one ugly shuiping, but it brews great tea, and I am sufficiently adept at fooling myself that the ugliness is indeed a kind of beauty rather than a reflection of it's owner's laziness :)
+1 👍🏻👍🏻
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OCTO
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Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:23 am

Tor wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 3:52 am
Re. pouring hot water over the pot, it shouldn’t be that complicated. Just brew the tea 4 different ways; no pouring, pouring after, pouring before, and pouring both before and after. If you don’t notice any difference, just don’t do it. But if you see the differences, choose the type of pouring according to the effect you aim for.

I give the taste and character of the tea my first priority, so I don’t mind any cosmetic outcome of the brewing method.
+1... yes.. keep it simple.
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