Light oolongs storage, freezer, how to unfreeze?

Semi-oxidized tea
tolean
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:13 am

Tue Sep 27, 2022 12:08 am

Hello tea people!
Recently i had a pretty expensive taiwanese oolong sample. I kept it in freezer as i do with other light oolongs(mostly Tg and Taiwanese). When I opened it there were many broken leaves. Most probably it happened not because of the freezing but while it was transported. Still it made me think about this. Can you please share your thoughts about some of my questions below or anything related to this topic that i will not mention:
1. What do you think about keeping teas in freezer? Do you practice it? What teas? Is it ok to keep them in home freezer or it should be colder etc...
2. Did you observe any improvements compared to the tea stored on a shell?
3. Can it happen that tea will ,,die,, ,,freeze,, or any other negative effect?
4. How do you ,, unfreeze,, it? How long before brewing you take it out from freezer? Any special actions before hitting it with hot water?
5. I am not a seller/shop, still sometimes i sell/send tea to people around because there are not too many good tea places where i leave. What would be the best way to send ,, unfrozen tea,,? Let's say i want to send 100g to a friend. Should I take it out and leave it unpacked for some time? Maybe keep it in the refrigerator then take it out ... What to do to sent the best tea to my friends/ customers (most of them i know personally) ?
Thank you all! And feel free to share any of your thoughts about anything related to light/green tea storage, freezing etc!
Wish you a great cup of tea!
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LeoFox
Posts: 1775
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2020 4:01 pm
Location: Washington DC

Tue Sep 27, 2022 7:33 am

If it’s ball rolled it really should not be broken up.

I store in the fridge only vacuum sealed green oolong and Japanese greens.

If it’s a small 50g bag, I let it acclimate 24 hours at room temperature before opening. Then I keep it at room temperature until I finish the bag

If it’s 100g or more, I acclimate it for 48 hours at room temperature
tolean
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:13 am

Tue Sep 27, 2022 11:01 am

Thank you for information!
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pedant
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Tue Sep 27, 2022 1:24 pm

tolean wrote:
Tue Sep 27, 2022 12:08 am
Hello tea people!
Recently i had a pretty expensive taiwanese oolong sample. I kept it in freezer as i do with other light oolongs(mostly Tg and Taiwanese). When I opened it there were many broken leaves. Most probably it happened not because of the freezing but while it was transported. Still it made me think about this. Can you please share your thoughts about some of my questions below or anything related to this topic that i will not mention:
1. What do you think about keeping teas in freezer? Do you practice it? What teas? Is it ok to keep them in home freezer or it should be colder etc...
2. Did you observe any improvements compared to the tea stored on a shell?
3. Can it happen that tea will ,,die,, ,,freeze,, or any other negative effect?
4. How do you ,, unfreeze,, it? How long before brewing you take it out from freezer? Any special actions before hitting it with hot water?
5. I am not a seller/shop, still sometimes i sell/send tea to people around because there are not too many good tea places where i leave. What would be the best way to send ,, unfrozen tea,,? Let's say i want to send 100g to a friend. Should I take it out and leave it unpacked for some time? Maybe keep it in the refrigerator then take it out ... What to do to sent the best tea to my friends/ customers (most of them i know personally) ?
Thank you all! And feel free to share any of your thoughts about anything related to light/green tea storage, freezing etc!
Wish you a great cup of tea!
1. i don't, but that would be fine i think. even better than fridge.
2. --
3. i don't think so, but for best results, i'd keep it in a freezer without an auto-defrost cycle feature.
4. remove from fridge and let it come to room temperature. this can take longer than expected, especially for larger bags of tea. if you open it before it warms up completely, moisture from the air can condense on the cold surface of the leaf (instead of harmlessly on the outside of the bag), and then your tea is damp. damp tea can change (most would say go bad) much faster.
5. i'm not sure i understand the question. i would package the tea in aluminized mylar bags and send it to them. and the tea should only be directly exposed to air when it's at room temp.
tolean
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:13 am

Tue Sep 27, 2022 1:39 pm

pedant wrote:
Tue Sep 27, 2022 1:24 pm
tolean wrote:
Tue Sep 27, 2022 12:08 am
Hello tea people!
Recently i had a pretty expensive taiwanese oolong sample. I kept it in freezer as i do with other light oolongs(mostly Tg and Taiwanese). When I opened it there were many broken leaves. Most probably it happened not because of the freezing but while it was transported. Still it made me think about this. Can you please share your thoughts about some of my questions below or anything related to this topic that i will not mention:
1. What do you think about keeping teas in freezer? Do you practice it? What teas? Is it ok to keep them in home freezer or it should be colder etc...
2. Did you observe any improvements compared to the tea stored on a shell?
3. Can it happen that tea will ,,die,, ,,freeze,, or any other negative effect?
4. How do you ,, unfreeze,, it? How long before brewing you take it out from freezer? Any special actions before hitting it with hot water?
5. I am not a seller/shop, still sometimes i sell/send tea to people around because there are not too many good tea places where i leave. What would be the best way to send ,, unfrozen tea,,? Let's say i want to send 100g to a friend. Should I take it out and leave it unpacked for some time? Maybe keep it in the refrigerator then take it out ... What to do to sent the best tea to my friends/ customers (most of them i know personally) ?
Thank you all! And feel free to share any of your thoughts about anything related to light/green tea storage, freezing etc!
Wish you a great cup of tea!
1. i don't, but that would be fine i think. even better than fridge.
2. --
3. i don't think so, but for best results, i'd keep it in a freezer without an auto-defrost cycle feature.
4. remove from fridge and let it come to room temperature. this can take longer than expected, especially for larger bags of tea. if you open it before it warms up completely, moisture from the air can condense on the cold surface of the leaf (instead of harmlessly on the outside of the bag), and then your tea is damp. damp tea can change (most would say go bad) much faster.
5. i'm not sure i understand the question. i would package the tea in aluminized mylar bags and send it to them. and the tea should only be directly exposed to air when it's at room temp.
Thank you!
Yeah the last question was about how to prepare more then 10-15 g of tea for future transportation. You got it right.
Thank for answering!
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teatray
Posts: 256
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2021 4:46 am
Location: Sofia, Bulgaria

Tue Sep 27, 2022 8:12 pm

Have done this for a while with coffee, now also tea. My rules of thumb (similar to posts above) are:
  • Only put in cold storage packs/containers that are:
    • factory sealed
    • perfectly sealed by yourself (e.g. using vacuum sealer)
  • Remove from cold storage long before opening, so dry leaf doesn't draw in moisture when opened (timing depends on amount, container type, and temp difference, but I think you're pretty safe removing 24h before opening, unless it's a larger amount, esp. from a freezer)
Does storing below 0C harm the tea? Probably not. Taste/texture-altering cell rupture (e.g. in meat) happens because of ice crystals. There's almost no water in dry leaf (not to mention that cell membranes do not remain fully intact after rolling & drying anyway). Aracha (unprocessed Japanese green tea after steaming and initial drying, analogous to maocha, more or less) is often stored below the freezing point and it has more water content (around 5%) than tea sold to consumers, which undergoes additional steps that dry if further (to 2% or so).

Perhaps freezing openly stored tea with higher water content (opened packs, pu-erh, etc.) could produce noticeable effects?
tolean
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:13 am

Wed Sep 28, 2022 12:38 am

teatray wrote:
Tue Sep 27, 2022 8:12 pm
Have done this for a while with coffee, now also tea. My rules of thumb (similar to posts above) are:
  • Only put in cold storage packs/containers that are:
    • factory sealed
    • perfectly sealed by yourself (e.g. using vacuum sealer)
  • Remove from cold storage long before opening, so dry leaf doesn't draw in moisture when opened (timing depends on amount, container type, and temp difference, but I think you're pretty safe removing 24h before opening, unless it's a larger amount, esp. from a freezer)
Does storing below 0C harm the tea? Probably not. Taste/texture-altering cell rupture (e.g. in meat) happens because of ice crystals. There's almost no water in dry leaf (not to mention that cell membranes do not remain fully intact after rolling & drying anyway). Aracha (unprocessed Japanese green tea after steaming and initial drying, analogous to maocha, more or less) is often stored below the freezing point and it has more water content (around 5%) than tea sold to consumers, which undergoes additional steps that dry if further (to 2% or so).

Perhaps freezing openly stored tea with higher water content (opened packs, pu-erh, etc.) could produce noticeable effects?
Thanks!
Andrew S
Posts: 704
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2021 8:53 pm
Location: Sydney, Australia

Wed Sep 28, 2022 12:54 am

I've never frozen or chilled any tea leaves.

However, I recall reading somewhere, sometime (possibly in the context of coffee; sorry, I really can't recall) that the problem you need to avoid if you cool your teas is the formation of frost or condensation on the leaves during the cooling or thawing phases (and that that is exacerbated if you don't consume them immediately, obviously).

Again, as I understand it, that risk is greatest when the leaves are kept in packets which contain residual moisture in the leaves or humidity in the air sealed inside. I assume that vacuum-sealed packs would likely reduce the risk, without eliminating it altogether unless the vacuum inside is perfect and the leaves were perfectly dry before they were sealed.

So presumably, once you freeze, thaw, and open a vacuum-sealed pack of tea, you can't freeze it again, because that would harm the leaves since they are now exposed to humidity and other moisture.

But as I said, I don't do this (mostly because I don't drink much fresh unroasted tea), so others may need to correct me.

Andrew
tolean
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:13 am

Wed Sep 28, 2022 1:05 am

Andrew S wrote:
Wed Sep 28, 2022 12:54 am
I've never frozen or chilled any tea leaves.

However, I recall reading somewhere, sometime (possibly in the context of coffee; sorry, I really can't recall) that the problem you need to avoid if you cool your teas is the formation of frost or condensation on the leaves during the cooling or thawing phases (and that that is exacerbated if you don't consume them immediately, obviously).

Again, as I understand it, that risk is greatest when the leaves are kept in packets which contain residual moisture in the leaves or humidity in the air sealed inside. I assume that vacuum-sealed packs would likely reduce the risk, without eliminating it altogether unless the vacuum inside is perfect and the leaves were perfectly dry before they were sealed.

So presumably, once you freeze, thaw, and open a vacuum-sealed pack of tea, you can't freeze it again, because that would harm the leaves since they are now exposed to humidity and other moisture.

But as I said, I don't do this (mostly because I don't drink much fresh unroasted tea), so others may need to correct me.

Andrew
Thank you sir!
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debunix
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Location: Los Angeles, CA

Wed Sep 28, 2022 9:22 am

Once upon a time I got a rather larger than expected quantity of lightly roasted oolong that came as a single package without any sign of vacuum, sealing or mention of nitrogen flushing. I divided it up into several portions, vacuum sealed each in vacuum bags, and stored them in the freezer by then brought each to room temperature at least overnight (the bags were thin and contained maybe 75 g of tea). It worked OK, but I prefer that such teas be vacuum sealed or nitrogen flushed in smaller portions so that I don’t have to do that work on my end as soon as the tea arrives .

Mostly, however, I try to avoid purchasing light roast/green oolong from suppliers that ship it without it being vacuum sealed or nitrogen flushed. And I try to be disciplined, and only allow one light roast oolong to be open at a time, even dividing packages, so that I’m drinking the same one at home and in my primary office at work so that I use it up before it loses its charm.

On those occasions when the tea arrives in a single package that is too long for me to use up in a reasonable period of time, I am more often just dividing it in half and vacuum sealing half And storing at room temperature with the intention of starting the second half as soon as I finish the first half. This works pretty well without refrigeration.

I use a food saver vacuum sealer that allows me to seal some more delicate twisted but not balled or flattened teas in glass mason jars with canning lids via through a jar-lid attachment. For these non-critical seals, I can reuse old lids that have already been used for pressure canning for many more times before they stop holding vacuum.
tolean
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:13 am

Wed Sep 28, 2022 2:41 pm

debunix wrote:
Wed Sep 28, 2022 9:22 am
Once upon a time I got a rather larger than expected quantity of lightly roasted oolong that came as a single package without any sign of vacuum, sealing or mention of nitrogen flushing. I divided it up into several portions, vacuum sealed each in vacuum bags, and stored them in the freezer by then brought each to room temperature at least overnight (the bags were thin and contained maybe 75 g of tea). It worked OK, but I prefer that such teas be vacuum sealed or nitrogen flushed in smaller portions so that I don’t have to do that work on my end as soon as the tea arrives .

Mostly, however, I try to avoid purchasing light roast/green oolong from suppliers that ship it without it being vacuum sealed or nitrogen flushed. And I try to be disciplined, and only allow one light roast oolong to be open at a time, even dividing packages, so that I’m drinking the same one at home and in my primary office at work so that I use it up before it loses its charm.

On those occasions when the tea arrives in a single package that is too long for me to use up in a reasonable period of time, I am more often just dividing it in half and vacuum sealing half And storing at room temperature with the intention of starting the second half as soon as I finish the first half. This works pretty well without refrigeration.

I use a food saver vacuum sealer that allows me to seal some more delicate twisted but not balled or flattened teas in glass mason jars with canning lids via through a jar-lid attachment. For these non-critical seals, I can reuse old lids that have already been used for pressure canning for many more times before they stop holding vacuum.
Sound good! Tank you!
Never tried a vacuum sealer but looks like i should consider buying one))
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debunix
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Location: Los Angeles, CA

Thu Sep 29, 2022 3:09 am

It is occasionally handy for tea, but I did not buy it for that. I bought it because I wanted to use my canning jars for bug proof storage of my beans and greens and dried herbs and spices, and I wanted to try and extend their shelflife by vacuum, sealing them between uses. I think it definitely helps minimize the cooking time required for beans, keep screen, fresher, and, both cuts down on the survival of the bugs that might occasionally hatch inside a jar of stuff because there’s less oxygen for them, and it make sure that they can’t escape the jar they hatched in.
tolean
Posts: 82
Joined: Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:13 am

Thu Sep 29, 2022 3:17 am

debunix wrote:
Thu Sep 29, 2022 3:09 am
It is occasionally handy for tea, but I did not buy it for that. I bought it because I wanted to use my canning jars for bug proof storage of my beans and greens and dried herbs and spices, and I wanted to try and extend their shelflife by vacuum, sealing them between uses. I think it definitely helps minimize the cooking time required for beans, keep screen, fresher, and, both cuts down on the survival of the bugs that might occasionally hatch inside a jar of stuff because there’s less oxygen for them, and it make sure that they can’t escape the jar they hatched in.
Good to know. Now i will have to dig in to see what type of vacuum sealers are there (power, form, price etc..):) . Can you tell me what are you using or there is no real difference between them?
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debunix
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Thu Sep 29, 2022 8:55 am

I have not used any other brand, so I cannot compare to others. The one I have is similar to this.
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teatray
Posts: 256
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Location: Sofia, Bulgaria

Fri Sep 30, 2022 3:30 am

tolean wrote:
Thu Sep 29, 2022 3:17 am
debunix wrote:
Thu Sep 29, 2022 3:09 am
It is occasionally handy for tea, but I did not buy it for that. I bought it because I wanted to use my canning jars for bug proof storage of my beans and greens and dried herbs and spices, and I wanted to try and extend their shelflife by vacuum, sealing them between uses. I think it definitely helps minimize the cooking time required for beans, keep screen, fresher, and, both cuts down on the survival of the bugs that might occasionally hatch inside a jar of stuff because there’s less oxygen for them, and it make sure that they can’t escape the jar they hatched in.
Good to know. Now i will have to dig in to see what type of vacuum sealers are there (power, form, price etc..):) . Can you tell me what are you using or there is no real difference between them?
Don't wanna stop you if vacuum sealing sounds like a fun thing to do, but if it's mainly for tea, esp. the TW oolongs you mentioned or many others that come sealed and ready for cold storage anyway (sencha, matcha, ...), I'd personally put it at the very bottom of the shopping list. Who knows, you might even discover the teas you like best don't benefit from sealing & cooling...
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