How I got started with Dan Cong

[Baisao]

So excited to find this thread! I stumbled on a Dancong while ordering from RedBlossom teas. Apparently, her Honey Orchid is one and it kicked my Arse! First few infusions were quite lovely then it pulled a jeckle and Hyde on me and turned monstrous! I’ve gotten mixed responses from people about wether it’s a high quality tea or not. (Sure wasn’t cheap) but I accidentally bought the big bag so I’m committed to continuing trying to enjoy it. I’ve got a few pots, a giawan, and a Celadon pot. Not sure which to try to brew it in? I was using my giawan when it turned on me before.

I know very little about the pots I have, I’m not even sure they are authentic at this point.

How did it turn ‘monstrous’?

[PamelaOry]

So excited to find this thread! I stumbled on a Dancong while ordering from RedBlossom teas. Apparently, her Honey Orchid is one and it kicked my Arse! First few infusions were quite lovely then it pulled a jeckle and Hyde on me and turned monstrous! I’ve gotten mixed responses from people about wether it’s a high quality tea or not. (Sure wasn’t cheap) but I accidentally bought the big bag so I’m committed to continuing trying to enjoy it. I’ve got a few pots, a giawan, and a Celadon pot. Not sure which to try to brew it in? I was using my giawan when it turned on me before.

I know very little about the pots I have, I’m not even sure they are authentic at this point.

How did it turn ‘monstrous’?

Incredibly bitter and astringent.

[Baisao]

So excited to find this thread! I stumbled on a Dancong while ordering from RedBlossom teas. Apparently, her Honey Orchid is one and it kicked my Arse! First few infusions were quite lovely then it pulled a jeckle and Hyde on me and turned monstrous! I’ve gotten mixed responses from people about wether it’s a high quality tea or not. (Sure wasn’t cheap) but I accidentally bought the big bag so I’m committed to continuing trying to enjoy it. I’ve got a few pots, a giawan, and a Celadon pot. Not sure which to try to brew it in? I was using my giawan when it turned on me before.

I know very little about the pots I have, I’m not even sure they are authentic at this point.

How did it turn ‘monstrous’?

Incredibly bitter and astringent.

What were your parameters?

I’ve found that dançong tends to be bitter and astringent in a pleasant way, like biting into a green twig. But bad tea of any kind can be unpleasantly bitter and astringent.

[debunix]

It’s less about authenticity with your pots then about a pot that works with your tea. I definitely have had sessions that have been just as nice from my cheapest unglazed pot as from my Chao Zhou purchased from Tea Habitat specifically because it was recommended for the Dan Congs. What does make a difference is glazed versus unglazed for sure, whereas a glazed vessel (gaiwan or pot or kyusu or shiboridashi), will keep in the maximum amount of fragrance, the unglazed vessel may tame some of the rougher notes more.

For me, a key with these particular teas is a low proportion of leaf to water, very hot water, and very short infusions, just a few seconds at the beginning, basically as fast as I can pour the water in and out.

[Andrew S]

I’ve found that dançong tends to be bitter and astringent in a pleasant way, like biting into a green twig. But bad tea of any kind can be unpleasantly bitter and astringent.

Based on my (very) limited experience, astringency seems to be a hallmark of dancong, like with young puer. Some people seem to enjoy its flavour while tolerating or controlling the astringency, whereas others (like myself) are afraid of it.

Better examples seem to be easier to brew, less bitter, and more complex in flavour or more comfortable in feeling, but they're still the same type of tea. It's a tea that I should explore a bit more, but perhaps slowly. I was put off for a long time by some bad examples early on in my journey.

@PamelaOry: you can make the most of a big bag of a tea that you don't enjoy by brewing it in lots of different ways, to learn what works well for you (but then conversely, if it's simply bad tea, then you shouldn't force yourself to finish it).

In any event, it's important to bear in mind that you've already bought it, so you need to put its cost out of mind, whether you brew it every day to learn what's best, or throw it away and move on to something more enjoyable.

Andrew

[Baisao]

Fewer bitter and astringent compounds are extracted at lower temperatures. Using high heat with intrinsically bitter and/or astringent tea makes no sense. Try shorter infusions, using less leaf to water, at 193° instead of 212°.

[Andrew S]

Fewer bitter and astringent compounds are extracted at lower temperatures. Using high heat with intrinsically bitter and/or astringent tea makes no sense. Try shorter infusions, using less leaf to water, at 193° instead of 212°.

I admit to being biased against leaves that don't like boiling water...

I'm still a little bit confused as to:
1) why dancong is brewed by some (not everyone) in the Chaozhou gongfu style; and
2) why dancong doesn't seem to have many examples of heavier roasts and heavier levels of oxidation, at least compared to yancha (but perhaps I just don't see them, or I don't look for them). Is it because people who enjoy dancong are looking for more floral and fruity flavours? The one that I enjoyed a little while ago was not a very 'green' example, and it worked very well for me.

Andrew

[Baisao]

Fewer bitter and astringent compounds are extracted at lower temperatures. Using high heat with intrinsically bitter and/or astringent tea makes no sense. Try shorter infusions, using less leaf to water, at 193° instead of 212°.

I admit to being biased against leaves that don't like boiling water...

I'm still a little bit confused as to:
1) why dancong is brewed by some (not everyone) in the Chaozhou gongfu style; and
2) why dancong doesn't seem to have many examples of heavier roasts and heavier levels of oxidation, at least compared to yancha (but perhaps I just don't see them, or I don't look for them). Is it because people who enjoy dancong are looking for more floral and fruity flavours? The one that I enjoyed a little while ago was not a very 'green' example, and it worked very well for me.

Andrew

As to 1, why not?

As to 2, generally more floral and fruity flavors but there’s some commonality between them.

[Bok]

@PamelaOry Dancong of lower to mid grade quality tends to be very fickle to brew. In addition Dancong gets stronger and stronger by the infusion for a long while before it suddenly is spent(in my experience with the teas at my disposal).

I’m one for high leaf to water ratio. Ideally a 60-80ml pot stuffed to the brim. First longer infusions then faster ones for a while until it falls off.

The sudden bitter kick is something I’d expect of a Dancong if brewed without information on how these teas are.

@Andrew S high roast is definitely out there but market demand at the moment is lighter roast, just as for Yancha.

I find vintage Chaozhou ideal for these teas, or the pots from Zoey. I got a one or two Yixing which is very good for these teas but it’s more a case of individual pot, rather than a specific Yixing clay.

[PamelaOry]

How did it turn ‘monstrous’?

Incredibly bitter and astringent.

What were your parameters?

I’ve found that dançong tends to be bitter and astringent in a pleasant way, like biting into a green twig. But bad tea of any kind can be unpleasantly bitter and astringent.

I partially followed the vendors recommendations (for leaf to water ratio and temp) and steeped about 5g leaves to 5 oz. Water at 210 for 30 second infusions. The vendor recommended a longer, western style steep time but I was doing gong fu cha style. The first few infusions were nice, somewhat floral but not very sweet which confused me as I was expecting honey sweetness. Then came the bitterness and astringency. Not at all pleasant.

I’m excited to try again and see if I can fine tune my process to be in harmony with this tea. So if I’m understanding correctly, I should try much shorter infusions?

[PamelaOry]

It’s less about authenticity with your pots then about a pot that works with your tea. I definitely have had sessions that have been just as nice from my cheapest unglazed pot as from my Chao Zhou purchased from Tea Habitat specifically because it was recommended for the Dan Congs. What does make a difference is glazed versus unglazed for sure, whereas a glazed vessel (gaiwan or pot or kyusu or shiboridashi), will keep in the maximum amount of fragrance, the unglazed vessel may tame some of the rougher notes more.

For me, a key with these particular teas is a low proportion of leaf to water, very hot water, and very short infusions, just a few seconds at the beginning, basically as fast as I can pour the water in and out.

I only care about authenticity as far as trusting that the materials used are safe to drink from. I was just afraid I had the cheapest of cheap knock offs with who knows what added to make the clay appear authentic. Perhaps they are safe after all!

[Baisao]

Incredibly bitter and astringent.

What were your parameters?

I’ve found that dançong tends to be bitter and astringent in a pleasant way, like biting into a green twig. But bad tea of any kind can be unpleasantly bitter and astringent.

I partially followed the vendors recommendations (for leaf to water ratio and temp) and steeped about 5g leaves to 5 oz. Water at 210 for 30 second infusions. The vendor recommended a longer, western style steep time but I was doing gong fu cha style. The first few infusions were nice, somewhat floral but not very sweet which confused me as I was expecting honey sweetness. Then came the bitterness and astringency. Not at all pleasant.

I’m excited to try again and see if I can fine tune my process to be in harmony with this tea. So if I’m understanding correctly, I should try much shorter infusions?

I’d try shorter infusions. Ditch the timer completely and focus on getting consistent color/flavor with each steep. This becomes intuitive in short order.

You don’t think about how you walk: put left leg out 18 inches and then fall forward and catch self with right leg that has moved out 18 inches. You simply walk. Making tea is the same thing. Your tea will suffer from overthinking it. There *is* a lot going on but simply focus on consistency using your internal feel for these things.

Dancong typically go for a very long time as @Bok was saying. And you have a lot of this tea. So you have a large number of steeps to practice this on.

You can always make it stronger by adding more heat and/or more time and/or more leaves.

If you were sitting in front of me I’d advise that you control most variables by starting at 5g/100ml @193° and not time your steeps. Try quick steeps and adjusting them shorter or longer to keep the brews consistent.

[PamelaOry]

@Baisao,
Thank you! I will do that.

[PamelaOry]

I’d try shorter infusions. Ditch the timer completely and focus on getting consistent color/flavor with each steep. This becomes intuitive in short order.

You don’t think about how you walk: put left leg out 18 inches and then fall forward and catch self with right leg that has moved out 18 inches. You simply walk. Making tea is the same thing. Your tea will suffer from overthinking it. There *is* a lot going on but simply focus on consistency using your internal feel for these things.

Dancong typically go for a very long time as Bok was saying. And you have a lot of this tea. So you have a large number of steeps to practice this on.

You can always make it stronger by adding more heat and/or more time and/or more leaves.

If you were sitting in front of me I’d advise that you control most variables by starting at 5g/100ml @193° and not time your steeps. Try quick steeps and adjusting them shorter or longer to keep the brews consistent.

Ok! I did as you suggested, brewing in my larger Yixing pot and wow! Not only did I avoid the bitterness, I actually tasted honey once! Most of the infusions were much nuttier though, pleasantly so. Also, I brewed A LOT of tea. The leaves went on forever. I didn’t time my infusions, and also forgot to count them but I’m sure there were 12-15 probably.
The first infusions were very short and my last one almost a songs worth I’d guess. I was grooving to the Eagles, brewing the hell outta that Dancong. Turns out, I actually like this tea.
Thank you!

[Bok]

@PamelaOry that’s a very nice development! Always better if it’s the person not the tea. Skills can be improved, but bad teas are just bad teas.