Raw Pu-erh from 2020 costs more than Raw Pu-erh from 2016

[mrmopu]

I agree with Bok about aet. Very humble and a good source of quality teas. Essence of Tea is also nice to answer your question about them. Vendors with boots on the ground are good places to start Sample, sample and sample some more. Realize Spring harvest is always more and the influx of buyers in a lot of areas are driving prices up and a lot is hyped over materials. Sometimes the prices for materials are way more than what the tea warrants.

[Tyler]

They are completely different teas from different producers so you can't really compare like that. As to why young puerh can be more expensive than aged, the price of raw material depends on the market and it tends to go up, so depending on how a vendor does their pricing the older cakes might end up being less expensive or the same price as the current year ones.

Thank you for your reply.

Could you possibly share any sources (websites) to buy good quality teas from?

As for now I only know very few of them
namely:

https://www.teavivre.com/

yunnansourcing.com

and recently I've also found

https://thechineseteashop.com/

looks promising.

But still haven't tried to buy anything from it.

Hi, Yunnan Sourcing is nice but I probably wouldn't recommend them to a beginner because they have so many teas that it's kind of overwhelming to choose what to get. white2tea I think is a pretty good place to start, it's a bit expensive but if you are just sampling they have a pretty good selection of like young, aged, sheng, shou, cheaper vs medium vs more expensive, etc... Also Liquid Proust's webshop has a lot of samples especially if you are looking to try more aged teas (like mid 2000s) EDIT but he is in the US. Essence of Tea is also a nice place to sample from. And like Bok said if you are in Europe check out some of the shops that ship from there, I don't know any personally but you can find some if you look around, you can see some in https://puerh.blog

[Konrud]

They are completely different teas from different producers so you can't really compare like that. As to why young puerh can be more expensive than aged, the price of raw material depends on the market and it tends to go up, so depending on how a vendor does their pricing the older cakes might end up being less expensive or the same price as the current year ones.

Thank you for your reply.

Could you possibly share any sources (websites) to buy good quality teas from?

As for now I only know very few of them
namely:

https://www.teavivre.com/

yunnansourcing.com

and recently I've also found

https://thechineseteashop.com/

looks promising.

But still haven't tried to buy anything from it.

Hi, Yunnan Sourcing is nice but I probably wouldn't recommend them to a beginner because they have so many teas that it's kind of overwhelming to choose what to get. white2tea I think is a pretty good place to start, it's a bit expensive but if you are just sampling they have a pretty good selection of like young, aged, sheng, shou, cheaper vs medium vs more expensive, etc... Also Liquid Proust's webshop has a lot of samples especially if you are looking to try more aged teas (like mid 2000s) EDIT but he is in the US. Essence of Tea is also a nice place to sample from. And like Bok said if you are in Europe check out some of the shops that ship from there, I don't know any personally but you can find some if you look around, you can see some in https://puerh.blog

Great, thank you for your explanation.

Haven't heard of white2tea before

I'll definitely check them out.

[Konrud]

But do they really have tea from 1990?
Like this one 1990's loose leaf raw puerh

Do you believe it's safe to buy this kind of tea from them?

Not sure about the 1990 leaves, but 1970 ones make some amazing soup! The viewtopic.php?f=12&t=12 topic should have some notes about it among myriad others. The 'what X are you drinking' topics are treasure troves!

Sounds interesting, I guess I'll need to read those 2 topics more carefully.

As for 1970's, wow would love to taste it.

[Konrud]

Would be happy to hear from you.

Stuff like BD requires to be at the present of the harvest trough the processing till the end.
I have only something what is some blend of near by villages and offer it only for sampling.
https://www.yunnancraft.com/en/sheng-pu ... 6-bing-dao

I'd also recommend to read short intro about situation ( still evolving ) here in Cihna.
https://www.pageoftea.com/tea-marketing

and spend some time with google finding other people blogs.

As already mentioned here. Sample here sample there. Take your time , don't try to speed up your learning process by drinking tons of samples a day ( sometimes takes few times to drink same tea to understand it ) .

Don't drink sheng on empty stomach ( especially the young ones ) .
Try also different storage ( wet / dry ) to find what are you into. If you like learning , sample systematically , not randomly.
You can create another thread for your questions related to your learning / sampling process , so it's not in this Bingdao one.
Should you have any question about our shop, please do not hesitate and PM me.

Appreciate your, comprehensive answer.
I agree, I need to sample on a regular basis so I could understand the concept better.
And to find that one that I'd hopefully choose to be the tea.

I'll definitely follow your suggestions.

As for a new thread. Good idea I shall probably do that.

[Konrud]

Konrud aet is too humble, but Yunnan crafts teas are very nice and very reasonably priced… also probably the most transparent vendor out there (to his own detriment : ) ).

If you’re EU-based I can also recommend Anmo Art cha out of Düsseldorf for Sunsing sourced HK stored Puerh. Really clean stuff.

Transparent, that's good, that's probably mean they can be trusted.

As for that EU-based shop. Do they ship worldwide?
Do they have a website or they only work offline?

Is there something specific you would suggest to try from them?

[Konrud]

teaswelike.com and puerh.uk are both good vendors selling quality puerh.

For reference, here's another youngish Bingdao https://puerh.uk/product/2014-bhyj-excl ... d-bingdao/
- Is it worth the price? For my preference too much money for too young tea. Is Bingdao in general worth the price? Not sure.

Great, thank you.
Little by little I've got myself a list of websites to check them out.

Have you bought anything from them (puerh.uk, teaswelike.com)?

Do you have something specific from them you would personally suggest?

I also appreciate your own opinion regarding Bingdao.

[Konrud]

teaswelike.com and puerh.uk are both good vendors selling quality puerh.

For reference, here's another youngish Bingdao https://puerh.uk/product/2014-bhyj-excl ... d-bingdao/
- Is it worth the price? For my preference too much money for too young tea. Is Bingdao in general worth the price? Not sure.

@.m

What are your thoughts about this one
2014 BHYJ BoHeTang (T5)?

Is that really that good to spend 1k on that?

[.m.]

Have you bought anything from them (puerh.uk, teaswelike.com)?

Do you have something specific from them you would personally suggest?

I don't want to recommend teas that are outside of my buying price range, no matter how excellent. Most puerh.uk teas fall in this category - however if you are into sheng puerh then the early CYH and BYH productions are i believe very worthy of tasting a sample.
From the current TWL lineup, this CYH jincha is a very decent tea and a good value
https://teaswelike.com/product/2011-che ... ai-jincha/
also at
https://puerh.uk/product/chen-yuan-hao- ... ai-jincha/
Still a bit young and could use few more years of aging, but it has some good qualities.

[Balthazar]

Would it be possible to ask where you buy your tea?

Certainly. For the last years almost all of the puer I've bought have come through Taiwanese FB auction pages. But I would definitely recommend sticking to ordinary "western facing" vendors until one has a proper understanding of one's own tastes. Another reason to stay off the auction pages in the beginning is the possibility of scams and/or horrible storage (it can be a huge time investment to find out which sellers to trust).

There are many good vendors to choose from, but it's hard to give specific recommendations without knowing more about what you're looking for and within what price range.

What's your favorite aged ( >= 15 years old) tea, perhaps not one, that you consume?

My "favorite"(s) are very situation dependent. Right now I'm on parental leave and have no time for focused sessions. Which means quick brewing, larger vessels, sudden session breaks with resumption hours later.

Under these circumstances I have been greatly enjoying (and the speed test supports this) a Taiwan dry (relatively) stored 2005 Xiaguan T8653 (January/February thick paper version) as well as some 2003/04 Changtai productions that had a decade or so of HK storage before moving to drier Taiwanese storage.

Would love to discover trusted (by the by, by trusted I mean the one that it's safe to buy from knowing you'll get the best quality product possible) websites to buy tea from?

I'm afraid I wouldn't know, I'm not in a situation where it would be appropriate to hunt for the best quality product possible. I wouldn't worry too much about this in the beginning anyways, the very best stuff can rarely be appreciated very early on. I'd rather try to get an idea of the general categories (age, storage, factory etc.) I'm into before going white whale hunting.

[aet]

Is Bing Dao worth it's price?
( assuming we are talking about the BD Lao Zhai )
Please note that I'm expressing only my opinion based on my current experience and current situation in China.

I have kinda definition / formula for tea ( probably more likely the most suitable for puer )
quality=value=price
I explain in details in blog here https://www.pageoftea.com/choosing-tea

but to make it short here: There is no something like that BD has some higher quality tea than other places. In fact , stuff from small trees you can get much better from other Mengku villages in much better quality and taste ( of course individual opinion ) , and for much much lower price. We all know that BD is the most hyped puer producing ( now not only puer actually ) village aside with LBZ and so the price is where it is ( coz don't forget China has a large population and lots of rich people willing to pay ).

But here comes the value variable! Is it worth it?

There is some market value of course but it's applicable to you ( as a drinker or vendor ) if you can exchange that for item in same value ( presumably the money ) . If not ( assuming you are not a vendor with such a clientele or not having enough trust / being known ) , you can just hype your EGO that you have tea worth of 10k , but should you try to sell it , you might get only 2k ( as the buyer would just judge a taste and giving the price based on comparing with other teas ) .
Personal value is something what comes with mentioned ego , but in China apart of that , there is another aspect :

If I was a owner of big company in Shenzhen ( just an example ) , I wouldn't mind for special business meetings to invest for tea honoring the name of fame, giving a big Mian Zi ( google it ) and lasting XX steepings which will "guarantee" me that before the reaching the end, I'll close the deal
So keep in mind that you are in competition with such a people for this kind of tea.

I've been to BD something like 6 - 7 years ago. My wife was making a marketing strategy plan for Mengku Rongshi and so we were invited ( she was, I was a additional baggage ) to Mengku and we spent there around a week ( mostly at their factory ) . She was working and I was drinking old teas with the founder ( he passed away couple years ago ). One day they took us to BD to show some old trees they renting there. We tried the tea of course and I have to say , I could get 10kg of nice tea ( in my taste preference ) of any other village for the price the half kg was sold there.

So for me , as a vendor ( not specializing on hyped products ..in fact avoiding them , as I do avoid other marketing stuff ) this tea has no even half of the value of what is it asked for on Chinese market.

For those , who are eager to buy LBZ , BD , 1000y old trees , very old puer , all that hard to get stuff .......ask your self a question . Is it personal value or personal EGO what makes you spend those $ ?

[LeoFox]

Is Bing Dao worth it's price?
( assuming we are talking about the BD Lao Zhai )
Please note that I'm expressing only my opinion based on my current experience and current situation in China.

I have kinda definition / formula for tea ( probably more likely the most suitable for puer )
quality=value=price
I explain in details in blog here https://www.pageoftea.com/choosing-tea

but to make it short here: There is no something like that BD has some higher quality tea than other places. In fact , stuff from small trees you can get much better from other Mengku villages in much better quality and taste ( of course individual opinion ) , and for much much lower price. We all know that BD is the most hyped puer producing ( now not only puer actually ) village aside with LBZ and so the price is where it is ( coz don't forget China has a large population and lots of rich people willing to pay ).

But here comes the value variable! Is it worth it?

There is some market value of course but it's applicable to you ( as a drinker or vendor ) if you can exchange that for item in same value ( presumably the money ) . If not ( assuming you are not a vendor with such a clientele or not having enough trust / being known ) , you can just hype your EGO that you have tea worth of 10k , but should you try to sell it , you might get only 2k ( as the buyer would just judge a taste and giving the price based on comparing with other teas ) .
Personal value is something what comes with mentioned ego , but in China apart of that , there is another aspect :

If I was a owner of big company in Shenzhen ( just an example ) , I wouldn't mind for special business meetings to invest for tea honoring the name of fame, giving a big Mian Zi ( google it ) and lasting XX steepings which will "guarantee" me that before the reaching the end, I'll close the deal
So keep in mind that you are in competition with such a people for this kind of tea.

I've been to BD something like 6 - 7 years ago. My wife was making a marketing strategy plan for Mengku Rongshi and so we were invited ( she was, I was a additional baggage ) to Mengku and we spent there around a week ( mostly at their factory ) . She was working and I was drinking old teas with the founder ( he passed away couple years ago ). One day they took us to BD to show some old trees they renting there. We tried the tea of course and I have to say , I could get 10kg of nice tea ( in my taste preference ) of any other village for the price the half kg was sold there.

So for me , as a vendor ( not specializing on hyped products ..in fact avoiding them , as I do avoid other marketing stuff ) this tea has no even half of the value of what is it asked for on Chinese market.

For those , who are eager to buy LBZ , BD , 1000y old trees , very old puer , all that hard to get stuff .......ask your self a question . Is it personal value or personal EGO what makes you spend those $ ?

This post is gold! Worth being in its own thread for sure

[Bok]

Is it personal value or personal EGO what makes you spend those $ ?

There is a third option: is it ignorance of what is what.

Brilliant post by the way!

[debunix]

For those , who are eager to buy LBZ , BD , 1000y old trees , very old puer , all that hard to get stuff .......ask your self a question . Is it personal value or personal EGO what makes you spend those $ ?

Once upon a time I tried a LBZ from Norbu as part of an organized tasting, and I ordered a small pouch of it afterwards because I liked it...but sadly I only bought the one. And when I realized how much I really wanted more, it was all gone. I've bought a variety of mostly inexpensive puerhs to try a variety of them, and a handful of pricier versions to see if I really liked them that much better. So far, the verdict is mixed. I find myself reaching for those Lao Cha Tou nuggets most often when it's puerh time.

[teatray]

Thanks @aet for the honest perspectives on this and other recent topics, much appreciated.